Home stator rewind

[Smokinapankake]

Anybody done it? Words of advice and experience are appreciated. I've looked through the stator papers and specifically how to rewire your own, just want to get others' experience/knowledge....

84 Kat 750 pop up

 

[salty_monk]

Remember seeing some posts on here incl one very comprehensive one a year or so back... guy doing it in his office at work

Personally for what they cost aftermarket & the hassle involved I think I'd buy one.

 

[SqDancerLynn1]

Here's all the info
http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=100230

 

[Clone]

Seriously, $134 to my door, with the cost of copper wire today, AND the hassle of wrapping it correctly, I just ordered a new one.

 

[Shaughn]

Seriously, $134 to my door, with the cost of copper wire today, AND the hassle of wrapping it correctly, I just ordered a new one.

Seriously. I have had my stator on the bench for almost a month now (many other projects as well) and have not yet found a reasonable supplier of the magnet wire. There were suggestions of asking local shops, but they only have it in bulk spools and want me to pay labor to wind onto spools putting it up to 45$/lb! Another shop told me flat out "For a small amount like that, All I'd do is buy it from McMaster and mark it up double to the public" and this is as I was calling on my factory's account. Online has been more or less a bust for me too, as the windmill hobbyists and the copper market have driven the market wild.

Does anyone have a good source for 2lbs of 17 or 18 AWG winding (magnet) wire? :-k


I'm hoping for around $15/# or less. $30/# or more, plus epoxy, plus shipping, is not worth the effort.

 

[Clone]

Ok, you are going to pay up to around $60 for the wire depending on where you get it, and I tell ya, I got my new stator in three days.

 

[Nessism]

Seriously. I have had my stator on the bench for almost a month now (many other projects as well) and have not yet found a reasonable supplier of the magnet wire. There were suggestions of asking local shops, but they only have it in bulk spools and want me to pay labor to wind onto spools putting it up to 45$/lb! Another shop told me flat out "For a small amount like that, All I'd do is buy it from McMaster and mark it up double to the public" and this is as I was calling on my factory's account. Online has been more or less a bust for me too, as the windmill hobbyists and the copper market have driven the market wild.

Does anyone have a good source for 2lbs of 17 or 18 AWG winding (magnet) wire? :-k


I'm hoping for around $15/# or less. $30/# or more, plus epoxy, plus shipping, is not worth the effort.

Silly question but why not just order from McMaster-Carr? They sell 300' for $26 of 18 gauge. Is that enough wire?

 

[Shaughn]

Silly question but why not just order from McMaster-Carr? They sell 300' for $26 of 18 gauge. Is that enough wire?

I was hoping for 17AWG, but for the 18AWG MMC is not a bad option, and at work I live off of them and MSCDirect. I wasn't sure if 300' was enough or not, but some cross referencing now from another supplier seems to place 1KG at just over 418', so backing around, 2lbs as specified elsewhere (hell, I forget where I got that idea that 2lbs was required) is about 380'. So by this halfarsed measure, a 300' would be shy. Still, MMC has 600' for $47 which isn't bad, but the bigger thing has been how on the fence I am about the whole thing. I also found a slightly better price here: http://www.bulkwire.com/product.asp?ProdID=7589

I really like the spirit of the DIY stator job, but I haven't seen evidence that this is long term cost effective. Especially if I have to rewind (due to chafing, etc) even once that takes the cost advantage right out. Also the MMC wire is coated, but not the bondable type of coating that bakes to itself, so from reading here and on other (windmill, other bikes) sites, some kind of epoxy would be recommended to stop vibration wire to wire. As I'm not an EE and all my electric design work has been tungsten filaments, I don't have an experience with what epoxy to choose, which leads to some hesitation on the whole deal. The epoxies that I think I want are in the $20 range, which isn't unreasonable, but adds to the cost effectiveness problem. What kind of engineer are you Ed? Any relevant winding experence to share? Much appreciated.

 

[Smokinapankake]

Thanks for all the replies, but not really answering the question. I realize fully the cost vs. time, I understand I could have one in 3 days, I see the point about the prices of copper. But what I don't get, buying a replacement unit, is the knowledge of exactly how they work and I don't get the satisfaction of stickin it to the man, if you know what I mean. How cool is that to say "Yeah, I was havin charging problems but I took the bull by the horns and rewound my stator. No big deal...."

I really get a charge out of doing it myself, and replacing the unit in my garage fulfills that to some degree, but repairing a known bad unit is something else indeed. R&R has come to mean remove and replace, not repair and revitalize..... It's why I refuse to give up on this possessed monster of a motorcycle.
All that being said, I still may not rewind my own.

 

[Shaughn]

Yeah, sorry to jack the thread.
Your sentiment describes mine perfectly, except that I have the added wrinkle that I cannot confirm online that I can even buy an aftermarket stator for my '78 GS750E.
Parts fiches show different numbers with no clear cross-reference, and so far searching the forum has not helped-yet. And if the aftermarket parts fit, for some reason they don't list it on either the electrex or dennis kirk websites.

 

[salty_monk]

I think you're crazy to even think about it.... no known reliability, no come back if it breaks.. blah blah

 

[Shaughn]

Well, its looking more and more like I don't have a choice, as there is no way I'm paying OEM prices right now. Found this on the sub-page of Electrex's site explaining the lack of listings.

NOTE: These 8-valve GS750 models have a 12-pole three phase stator that has identical dimensions to the later 18-pole units (=ElectroSport ESG010). You can use an ESG010 in these older 8-valve models, but you will have to use the later model (80-83) GS850 flywheel. If you fail to change the flywheel the number of magnet poles does not match the stator and you will have NO OUTPUT from your new 18-pole stator.

Changing my flywheel is even less a desirable option. I'm going to post some questions about this to a new thread so I don't jack this thread.

 

[Smokinapankake]

Shaugn,

No worries. Information is good no matter where it comes from.
I've yet to decide whether or not I will rewind my own, just was hoping for some info from others who have done it. The other link that was posted to the guy who did his own was very interesting and just for the fun of it I may (or may not) try....

In my life it usally boils down to whether I want to spend my time or my money, most often I prefer to spend my time.

 

[Matchless]

This is actually very do-able! Getting the correct # wire is important and heavier is better, but more difficult to wind tightly and takes up more space, You actually use three similar lengths for each phase, wound on 4 poles for a 12 pole and 6 poles for an 18 pole stator.
Unwind one phase carefully and count the number of turns, then measure the length and use the old wire to practice on the stator first so that you can get the hang of it. The windings must be just about perfectly next to each other so as to not waste space and also no allow them any movement when heated up.
Make a couple of wooden guides with some dowels to push and keep the wire tight. Use a master wooden dowel with a hole all the way through it, about the size of a bic pen, thread the wire through it and use the tip to get the windings tightly laying next to each other.
Resin is easily bought from a rewinding shop if you take your own container and baked hard in your oven at home. You could most likely use apoxy adhesive available over the shelf as well.
Radio hams also use enameled copper wire to make coils and you may find they have a source as well.
Its really not that difficult and just needs patience and a bit of dexterity.
Make a feeder for your wire so that it comes off straight off a the coil and does not kink when some slack forms a loop.
Good luck and let us know the outcome!

 

[Smokinapankake]

Thanks for the advice Match, I appreciate your words of wisdom. I'm still deciding whether or not I will, but I'm leaning toward doing it just for the experience.

I'll post pictures if I do...

 

[Smokinapankake]

So, just to update as I like closure, I did my own rewind and measured somewhere in the vicinity of .7 to .9 ohm resistance among the 3 phases, with infinite resistance between the three and ground. Looks good electrically but not so good visually. I tore the he!! out of my hands doing this and am not 100 percent sure I got the same # winds on each pole. I may be + or - 1 or 2 at the most. At any rate, I got to thinking about it and decided that, since I just wired in a beefmaster CBR R/R and don't really want to cook it, and am a little suspicious of my own handiwork, I ordered a new stator from Electrosport. I'll keep the rewound stator as a backup but for now I have a new stator and new R/R wired in. This should eliminate any charging problems for now and hopefully forever!!

1 pound of 18ga magnet wire cost me all of 12 bucks. This provided ample wire to do the stator and then some.

I did take pictures as promised, but since I'm at work and don't have access to them, I'll post later tonight...
Thanks for all the advice everyone, this has been a learning experience and gets me closer to my motorcycle. This forum is great!

 

[Nessism]

Great job on the rewind but you are wimping out by not running it. Slam it in and crank up the bike. CRB R/R's are a dime a dozen so give it a go (easy for me to say).

 

[Smokinapankake]

Ya know, Ness, I had the same thought but what I dont want to do is (admitting ashamedly) redo the whole thing, i.e., find another R/R, take it all apart and wire it all back in, maybe have to get another gasket, etc... The damm bike's been sitting too long already, mornings here are in the mid 50's to low 60's (winter is coming fast), and I just want to be done with it..... Haven't had enough riding time as it is!

 

[Matchless]

Good job on the rewinding and will appreciate the pictures when you have time.
If the windings were done with the correct rotations and poles and test as you said it should work.
There are so many fried rotors out there that maybe another forum member could test it for you in return for his fried one? It would be worth it to know that your handywork is usefull!:-k
Again well done!

 

[mixongw]

Seriously. I have had my stator on the bench for almost a month now (many other projects as well) and have not yet found a reasonable supplier of the magnet wire. There were suggestions of asking local shops, but they only have it in bulk spools and want me to pay labor to wind onto spools putting it up to 45$/lb! Another shop told me flat out "For a small amount like that, All I'd do is buy it from McMaster and mark it up double to the public" and this is as I was calling on my factory's account. Online has been more or less a bust for me too, as the windmill hobbyists and the copper market have driven the market wild.

Does anyone have a good source for 2lbs of 17 or 18 AWG winding (magnet) wire? :-k


I'm hoping for around $15/# or less. $30/# or more, plus epoxy, plus shipping, is not worth the effort.

I just ordered 300' of 18 AWG enameled copper from McMaster-Carr for $21.00 and a can of spray high temp sealant for use in motor windings for $7.30.