Three GS questions

[kerrfunk]

Hey gang. I have three questions. And a story.

One, is it okay to take my bike to one of those carwashes where you spray your car by hand? Are there parts to avoid spraying?

Two, my bike has been revving really high lately, especially when I run it for more than a few minutes. Like if I'm in 5th gear, and I'm not twisting the throttle, and I pull the clutch in, the RPMs might go up to 3,500. Or if I come to a traffic light and put it in neutral or first (with the clutch in), again, maybe 3,000 RPM.

Three, I had a mystery oil leak, and I'm not sure if it's gone or not. When I took a 4-day bike trip in October, it started out okay, but towards the end of the trip my right toe and shin was getting pretty oily while riding. It wouldn't actively drip when parked.
Yesterday I replaced the oil filter (more on that below). I drained all the oil from the bottom pan and the oil filter cover as well, I replaced the oil filter cover O-ring thing, and I removed, cleaned, and re-installed the right engine cover. I have ridden two miles since then, so I don't know if the mystery leak is gone.

Story: as I was changing my oil yesterday, I grabbed a new oil filter cover O-ring. But it seemed the teeniest bit too small. Like half a millimeter small. And like an idiot, I proceed to install it. I finish the oil change and dash off to the gas station to fillerup. Two miles from home. I pull away from the gas station and notice that I'm pouring oil out. I pull over into a parking lot and I just know it's that O-ring. I call my wife, she picks me up in her car, I grab the tools I need to do an on-the-road oil change, and she takes me back to the parking lot. I use the old O-ring, I put another quart in, and I ride home no problem. I put clean paper under the bike when I parked it last night, and there are no drips this morning.

 

[bccap]

I had the high idle issue after warm up once. New carb boot O rings solved it......

 

[kerrfunk]

I had the high idle issue after warm up once. New carb boot O rings solved it......

Hmm... would that be a source of oil as well?

 

[bccap]

Hmm... would that be a source of oil as well?

Can't see how. The only thing that goes through there is gas and air......

 

[chuck hahn]

A heat gun will help relax the orings as they are usually bent and twisted when put in the box with the filter. second, just a ever so small dot of RTV will help hold it in the groove and not slip out as you replace the cover. YEAH YEAH on all you guys that are gonna have heart attacks with the RTV suggestion. It hasnt flaked off or clogged any passage in any bike i have owned in 20+ years.

Oil could be from the oring, a clutch cover gasket leak, filler cap oring leak,

 

[Redman]

Kerry, The conversation is going to get awkward. Would be best to post each question in a seperate thread.

Hey gang. I have three questions. .............

One. Car wash.
Some folks will say that is terrible, never do that.
I would say not to make a regular habit of it. Is good for engine degreasing and road grime on the wheels and inside the fenders.
Avoid the areas of bearings (axles, steering neck, swingarm pivot).
Then take it home to finish off by bucket washing.

Two, High Idle.
If this happens only after it warms up: THis is a symptom of air leaking in after the carbs, typically the orings in the carb boots. But can also be the boots them selves, or boots slipping off the carbs.
I dont understand the physics of how this lean condition makes the idle go high, but have learned here is a characteristic of these engine, and then have experienced it myself. I experienced it also with the oring in the enricher (choke) mechanism.

Three, Oil leak.
I say 2 two mile trips are not a good test.
Right pantleg... I would suspect the clutch shaft seal.... but can somewhat track it down visually. Also look infill cap. area of the clutch cover gasket, or the fill cap.
Maybe cylinder base gasket.
Check to see there still an oring on the oil fill cap.
Probably needs to run lot longer, get engine good an warm for a longer time.
I doubt the oil filter cover leak would show up on one pant leg.

Good story.

 

[GSXR7ED]

Hey Kerry,

1. I've taken my "T" to a power wash station once in NM. I stayed away from electrical connections and avoided the carbs and intake area. I sprayed the engine area with an engine cleaner and then washed it off...it started right up and I air dried it home.

2. I haven't had the high-rev issue and glad to learn from Garth and Redman that good intake boots and proper seal are essential.

3. As Redman suggests...check that o-ring on the oil fill cap. I replaced the clutch gasket when I was tracking an oil leak on my left side gear shifter. It was heavy during long rides.

That's an interesting story. When you felt the oil filter o-ring was too small, you knew something was up. The quirks we learn maintaining our GS'.

Ed

 

[Steve]

Will pretty much concur with the others. :-k

1. Car wash. Others have suggested the obvious spots to avoid: electrics, bearings, etc. One thing I would suggest as a preventive measure is to spray your spark plug wires with WD-40 before you go, and take the can with you. If your plug wires have any small cracks in them, they likely are not a problem when dry, but will short out when wet. When you apply that 40th attempt at a Water Dispersing formula (WD-40), it will get rid of the water and let you start the bike.

2. High idle. Also agree with the others on the likely causes: boots and o-rings. The enricher o-rings might be a problem, but I have never encountered that, even with all the carbs I have rebuilt for others. The only time they seem to be a problem is when the carbs are assembled incorrectly and one or more of them can not seat properly when the choke lever is in the RUN position. If it has not been a problem until recently, I would not suspect the "choke", but would go straight to the o-rings on the intake boots.

3. Mystery oil leak. Any chance you had just changed the oil before that trip? Did you remember to remove BOTH drain plugs? :-k
The 650 has two drain plugs. One does the main oil sump, the other one drains the reservoir around the secondary gears. If you don't drain both areas and just add the "proper" amount of oil without checking the window, it could be overfilled. If the leak is from the oil filler cap, as some have suggested, I don't know how your toe would be getting wet, but I have never seen how you sit while riding.

4. Oil filter o-ring. I have also had the occasional o-ring that was a bit snug, and others that were simply warped to the point where they would not stay in place. Chuck says he uses a dab of RTV, but I prefer to use a bit of grease. Might be Vaseline, might be axle grease or anything between, but it is thick enough to act like a glue to hold the o-ring in place.

.

 

[kerrfunk]

The 650 has two drain plugs. One does the main oil sump, the other one drains the reservoir around the secondary gears. If you don't drain both areas and just add the "proper" amount of oil without checking the window, it could be overfilled. If the leak is from the oil filler cap, as some have suggested, I don't know how your toe would be getting wet, but I have never seen how your sit while riding.

Hm. I drain the one in the bottom center, and the one where the actual oil filter is. I'm guessing that secondary gear thing is another place to drain? I'll have to find that.

 

[KEITH KRAUSE]

1. Don't wash your bike with high pressure water. It's abuse if you point the sprayer at fork seals, chain, bearings or anywhere there's wiring. There's no way to remove the water and soap that's sitting in every nook and cranny. I go a step further and have only used a hose (open end) on my GS maybe 3 times in 39 years. I use a damp towel and follow that with a dry towel. My GS is as clean a bike as you'll ever see.

2. Classic sign of an intake leak. Probably the manifold(s).

3. There are only so many places that could leak on the right side. There's no covers that easily hide a leaky gasket. I would say clean it off completely, set it on the centerstand, put a fan on it and let it run. If you did a VERY good job of cleaning/drying the oil off, then as you inspect every inch of gasket by dabbing it with a clean white paper towel, you'll have to see some "excess" oil appearing at some point.

 

[Steve]

Hm. I drain the one in the bottom center, and the one where the actual oil filter is. I'm guessing that secondary gear thing is another place to drain? I'll have to find that.

The drain is behind the center one and more to the left. Pretty much under the shifter lever.

The 850, 1000 and 1100 shafties have a separate reservoir for hypoid gear oil for the secondary gears, but the 650 and the 450GA use oil fed from the engine.

You are not doing any great harm by not draining the secondary reservoir, but you are not starting with as much fresh oil as you think. The oil circulates throughout the whole system, you have simply been starting each "fresh" oil change with a few ounces of old oil.

.

 

[Guest]

a few minor additions: do you use the suzuki o-ring? there is a difference.... As for the oil leak, i have had a valve cover leak that ended up in surprising places, worth a good look...