Zagg's Project: '78 GS750E

[Zagg]

Hello fellow riders and GSer's. In November 2015 I bought a 1978 GS750E from a guy in Hanover, PA. The Story: The bike was in the process of being stripped and rebuilt before being given up on. It was then sold to the guy I purchased it from who essentially bought it and then put it in his garage and didn't touch it. I think he replaced the starter with a used one and that's about it. He owned it for about a year. As the story goes, he bought it with the intention of building a cafe and ended up buying one that was already 90% there so this one just sat gathering dust and rust. His friend had the same intention before selling it to him. It has 32000 miles on the title and 28000 on the tach.

This is what it looked like when I unloaded it...

 

[Zagg]

The bike came with two totes of parts which include just about everything that is missing... Signals, gauge cluster, starter and clutch cover, chain, headlight, airbox, etc. It also has a 4 into 1 V&H exhaust and another head and an extra set of jugs. The P.O. said it was "bored over to an 850" but I'm not sure how you bore a cylinder head without the cylinder head. Anyway, that whole thing will get sorted out later. I will take some more detail pics when I can. I have read over many threads here and several hours worth of info on BikeCliff's website.

I started by buying a Clymer manual and downloading and printing out the owner's manual from Cliff's site. There are so many projects on this bike that I was a little uncertain about where to start... Seemed the best place would be to get the carb's rebuilt so I can get the engine running. I ordered o-rings from Mr. Barr, a used wiring harness, carb gaskets, airbox boots, and a shim tool.

The original wiring harness is chopped up. It looks like one of the P.O.'s started to rewire it. None of the electrical is hooked up. Battery is out and bone dry. Clutch, throttle, and brakes are all disconnected. All fluids have previously been drained. Some of the tabs have been shaved I think for the battery box and the seat, headlight and gauges are off, etc., etc.

 

[Zagg]

There is 1 broken stud for the exhaust and I cannot remove the screws for the carb to head boots or the stator cover. I have been hitting the stator cover screws with PB every time I remember, but they are fairly solid. I am looking at old school impact drivers and also bidding on a couple reman Dewalt impact drivers on ebay. I have a set of Dewalt tools already and would like to "keep it in the family" so to speak... Really, I'm broke and shrewd and have no interest in starting a new and ridiculously expensive tool set with new rechargeable batteries.

So I am the owner / operator of a landscape/hardscape/maintenance business that I run from a 10x30 storage unit because I do not own my own property. That is where the bike is and where my "shop" is. (You'll get the idea from the pics)

 

[Zagg]

Okay, so I am a single dad with two little girls so did I mention I'm broke? I wanted to DIY the carb cleaner because I would have to have the Berryman's shipped and everything else is too expensive. I decided on apple cider vinegar and Pinesol.



My dipper...

 

[Zagg]

So, here is the stripped screw and a look at the carbs before cleaning...







One thing not pictured here is the dust from what I think was evaporated fuel that came out of the bottom of the carb / float bowl....

 

[SVSooke]

If you can get the other screw out without stripping it the stripped one may come off if you twist it.

 

[Zagg]

If you can get the other screw out without stripping it the stripped one may come off if you twist it.

Good call on that one. I didn't have to unscrew that plate for carb work so I just left it for now, but the other screw did turn.

 

[Zagg]

Okay, so as for carb cleaning, here are the results...
With vinegar first..

This was after about 12 hours...





Here you can see the deposits got chunky and actually could just be wiped out.


That was after 24 hours in vinegar. I realized the vinegar was probably most effective on rust so I used a Pinesol bath for 24 hours and got this...


I ended up agitating it in water and then vinegar again to get it all off. Compressed air helped a lot too. Some wire brushing, a little carb cleaner, and I ended up with this...







For whatever reason the Pinesol didn't react on the brass like it did on the zinc. I'll have to ask my brother - he's a chemist.

 

[Zagg]

After researching some of the ingredients in the carb dips I ended buying lacquer thinner to try. I will post back. Looks like it will have similar results to the vinegar. I am actually having the biggest issues with the old float bowl gasket. I have to scrape it gently with a razor knife and scrub it to get it off. Nothing I've used has cut through it.

I do want to report one concern. It seems the acid in the vinegar starts to eat the zinc. After the Pinesol bath I rinsed in vinegar again and was wiping the carb off when I noticed that what was coming off was the same color as the carb itself. I started another can of water and baking soda to balance the pH to hopefully stop the reaction which seemed to work. Once it was dry it didn't come off again.

I also thinned the Pinesol with water to help prevent the caking. The storage unit is unheated so I think the cold and the lack of dilution caused the caking and I also think that having warm or hot liquids would do a better job cleaning. I checked for a crock pot at goodwill but they are pretty well cleaned out of anything for cooking or gifts this time of year.... I may buy a coffee pot from there to use. I have done small 2-cycle partial carb rebuilds, but I wanted to keep this operation to 1 carb at a time til I got the feel for what I was dealing with and reassembly and o-ring replacement. It keeps everything organized better for me to just work on one at a time although I am confident at this point with the process.

 

[Zagg]

The set screws were already tampered with on carb #4 (the first one I am working on) so I just turned the screw in to where the mark on the housing was and counted from there. I enhanced the marks with the blade of a razor knife. Worked well.

 

[Zagg]

I read about some guys using egg cartons to separate carb parts. I would recommend against this for 1 reason: The egg carton will dump simply by catching your shirt or jacket on it... (yep, twice) I would recommend a ziplock or tupperware that can be closed / sealed. I just happened to have straw on the floor of the unit from a partial bale I have to overseed with.... Imagine my dismay when I realized how similar brass and straw are in color....



Notice the long, narrow shape as well... LOL

 

[Zagg]

I may just keep the vinegar for inside the fuel tank and other rusty parts. I believe I may have eaten the finish off the 1st carb I dipped. I will stick to the lacquer thinner and Pinesol for #2. It has soaked all weekend. It will get the Pinesol dip tomorrow. Just an FYI, the vinegar was about $4 a gallon at Walmart and the Pinesol was $3 a quart at Dollar General. I got the Mexican Pinesol which is called Pinalen and is as far as I can tell just Pine oil. The gallon of Pinalen was roughly $5-$6. 1/2 gallon of lacquer thinner was $15.

 

[Zagg]

Setting the float...

 

[Zagg]

I disassembled the airbox to see what needed done there... The boots were hard as a rock. I had to cut a couple of them to pull them out of the airbox. Found the boots for a good price from ebay seller "partzillamarketplace" $12 a boot.







Unfortunately I found this...

 

[Zagg]

The airbox itself doesn't seem too terribly bad rust wise. It's what struck me about this bike from the beginning... There is a little rust here and there, but nothing like what I thought should be there on a 37 year old bike. That was a big reason I decided to make an offer on it. Asking price was $400. I offered him $300 and he accepted. He didn't want the bike and he was a chemist like my brother coincidentally so I know how much money he is making. I threw out a take it or leave it offer. I wasn't going to negotiate but it turns out I didn't have to. The bike needs more work than I wanted to put into it, but I feel pretty confident in getting it road worthy with the help of the manuals and the many knowledgeable and incredibly helpful people here. Doesn't seem like I will have it ready for Spring but I think with rebuild kits for the master cylinders, petcock, some fork work, new stator, new R/R, cleaning, tweaking, lubing, some wiring and some luck I will be able to breath some new life into this old girl by Summer or Fall of 2016 and she can promptly breath some new life into me.

 

[Datsa Noydb]

Personally, I think that for all the fussing around that you are doing with all those various chemicals, you could have gone to your local auto parts store or Wal-Mart and gotten a can of Berryman's and had the job done correctly. For the record, GUNK brand carb dip does a fine job, as well as Yamaha's concentrated dip.

Think about how you had stuff cake on the outside surfaces of your carbs. You had to mechanically brush them off. Now consider that it's the INSIDE passages that are really critical, not the outside surfaces. Did you scrub them clean, as well?

Other than that, it appears that you are doing a decent job. :encouragement:

 

[loud et]

Vinegar will definately eat the aluminum on various parts. Once I filled my tank with the high strength vinegar for derusting, it both ate the petcock and the 2 locking nubs on the fuel cap. It also ate the inside of the fuel cap lock and I couldn't get the cap off.
A bit too strong for 24 hour soaking when aluminum is involved.
The pine sol soak seems to have worked for you. I think the cold was certainly a negative factor. Others here I believe put the carbs in a big pot and put them on the stove burner(camping stove/hot plate) and get it nice and hot. That seems to do really well.
Also definately get the old hammer style impact driver. Some screws simply cannot be removed without one. Wack wack, success.

 

[Zagg]

Personally, I think that for all the fussing around that you are doing with all those various chemicals, you could have gone to your local auto parts store or Wal-Mart and gotten a can of Berryman's and had the job done correctly. For the record, GUNK brand carb dip does a fine job, as well as Yamaha's concentrated dip.

Think about how you had stuff cake on the outside surfaces of your carbs. You had to mechanically brush them off. Now consider that it's the INSIDE passages that are really critical, not the outside surfaces. Did you scrub them clean, as well?

Other than that, it appears that you are doing a decent job. :encouragement:

Yeah, I know. It turned out to be a pain in the ass and not worth it, but my local Walmart didn't have the Berryman's according to the website and the Advance and Autozone stuff was pricy. My mistake and I certainly won't make it again. On the plus side, the lacquer thinner is working well so far and the vinegar works well on the brass.

 

[Zagg]

Vinegar will definately eat the aluminum on various parts. Once I filled my tank with the high strength vinegar for derusting, it both ate the petcock and the 2 locking nubs on the fuel cap. It also ate the inside of the fuel cap lock and I couldn't get the cap off.
A bit too strong for 24 hour soaking when aluminum is involved.
The pine sol soak seems to have worked for you. I think the cold was certainly a negative factor. Others here I believe put the carbs in a big pot and put them on the stove burner(camping stove/hot plate) and get it nice and hot. That seems to do really well.
Also definately get the old hammer style impact driver. Some screws simply cannot be removed without one. Wack wack, success.

This is off the shelf vinegar and it seems to need a minimum of 24 hours to have any effect, but yeah, I won't be soaking the carb bodies in it anymore. I was working on the stator cover again tonight and got all but 2 screws off...

 

[Zagg]

Had a hell of a time with those stator cover screws! I used the Dewalt on the hammer drill setting (yeah I know, not the same) I leaned on the drill and gently applied pressure. I was able to break all but 2. Looks like thread lock on the ends of the screws....


This one didn't like the phillips head so I cut a slit with the dremel, applied heat, and voila!



This one has turned out to be the stubborn one. I am losing the battle currently....
[URL=http://s863.photobucket.com/user/zaggnutt/media/78%20GS750/20151221_185813_zpsfblp6rma.jpg.html][/URL]

The last one is the very bottom screw and I haven't really messed with it yet. I believe I am going to get a proper impact driver before I go back to these last two.

I did however get the intake boots to come loose!



Clean em up, pop in the new o-rings and we should be good to go! Thanks for taggin' along!