chain keeps loosening

[tkent02]

The longest point is for the chain is where the countershaft, the swingarm pivot and rear axle are all in alignment, usually about where the suspension sits with the rider's weight on it. If it's not too tight there it won't be too tight anywhere. Still I think 3/4 inch of play there is too tight.

 

[tatu]

The longest point is for the chain is where the countershaft, the swingarm pivot and rear axle are all in alignment, usually about where the suspension sits with the rider's weight on it. If it's not too tight there it won't be too tight anywhere. Still I think 3/4 inch of play there is too tight.

You could be right, I like mine on the 'unslack' (not tight) side because it takes the 'snatch' out from deceleration to acceleration. Having said that I also don't take a measure tape out on adjustment just do it, feel it, with my finger and call it done.

 

[tkent02]

You could be right, I like mine on the 'unslack' (not tight) side because it takes the 'snatch' out from deceleration to acceleration. Having said that I also don't take a measure tape out on adjustment just do it, feel it, with my finger and call it done.

Proper tuning takes the snatch out too.

 

[earlfor]

You could be right, I like mine on the 'unslack' (not tight) side because it takes the 'snatch' out from deceleration to acceleration. Having said that I also don't take a measure tape out on adjustment just do it, feel it, with my finger and call it done.

I've set chain slack of the lower run of the chain at midpoint at 1 1/4" of slack above and 1 1/4" of slack below, (for a total slack of 2 1/2") on every GS I have owned and on my Bandit these past 9 years. I never need to make a chain adjustment between tire changes. (12 to 15 thousand miles) The slack doesn't change. Too tight a chain will destroy a chain quicker than about anything else. I have no problem with chain snatch. I downshift to speed up, never to slow down. I use brakes for that.

 

[earlfor]

Proper tuning takes the snatch out too.

Yeah, if the engine isn't smooth, it ain't a gonna roll smooth either.

 

[tkent02]

2 1/2 inches or at least 2 inches is more like where it should be set. With a new chain and sprockets I never have to readjust anything between tire changes.

 

[earlfor]

2 1/2 inches or at least 2 inches is more like where it should be set. With a new chain and sprockets I never have to readjust anything between tire changes.

I learned what the correct chain adjustment is from my old days of installing chains too tight and finding that in a couple hundred miles, the chain had stretched well beyond where I had set it. It finally dawned on me that when you set a chain too tight, it will naturally stretch until it reaches the slack it must have. As it turned out, the chains kept telling me what was the correct amount of slack, but I was too focused on tight to listen to what the bike was saying. heh eh 2 to 2 1/2" is usually what bike is going to say.

 

[tatu]

You're both right. my 1000 has a 630 and I cant remember the last time I had to adjust it. The sticker on the chain adjuster gives it about a 1/4 of rearward movement on the wheel before a new chain is required. My first 'S' I only had one chain change in 60+k miles including at least a couple'v trips over Europe and one into the sahara, a lot of abrasive dust and sand there plus I lost my chain lube way down and used ordinary engine oil, and this one spent much time on its back wheel.
I have never had a chain fail.

 

[chuck hahn]

I tighten the adjusters first then do the axle bolt. No rags, no putting it in gear, no hammer slapping. The back surface of the adjuster is supposed to be holding against the axle, so tightening them first ( in theory ) holds the axle in the very last rearmost position as was applied with the adjuster. then tightening the axle bolt squeezes against the bushings and swing arm to secure it in place.

I cant recall any chain ever mysteriously going loose after Ive adjusted one.

 

[earlfor]

I tighten the adjusters first then do the axle bolt. No rags, no putting it in gear, no hammer slapping. The back surface of the adjuster is supposed to be holding against the axle, so tightening them first ( in theory ) holds the axle in the very last rearmost position as was applied with the adjuster. then tightening the axle bolt squeezes against the bushings and swing arm to secure it in place.

I cant recall any chain ever mysteriously going loose after Ive adjusted one.

Yep, +1 on tightening the adjusters first. That stops the axle from walking rearward when the axle nut is tightened. The adjusters don't have to be more than finger tight. All they need is to be in contact to stop any axle movement.

 

[megatwin]

I'm guessing you have already checked the sprocket drive cushions?

 

[bwanna]

Thanks everyone for the great feedback. I just replaced the tire a few weeks ago and inspected everything internal as part of the process. Anyway, most of that is new within the recent year.

Here's a video of me tensioning the chain. It appears that NOT doing this under load could be the culprit. I was tensioning it on the center stand and clearly once placed under load the chain was too tight. What likely has been happening is it stretched a bit and found it's own appropriate slack. While I don't think 2.5" is right for a road setting (vs a motoX), I realize that my technique had been making the chain too tight.

I've only put about 100 miles on since doing this, but expect to do about 500 more during the next few days. Will check it again and let you all know.

http://www.4shared.com/video/6c1pIj6tba/chain_tensioning_gs450.html

Cheers

 

[platinum2]

are you sure the chain isnt stretching , knock off chains will stretch a lot before settling in, and depending on the torq and how hard you ride, just something to think about

 

[bwanna]

I'm guessing you have already checked the sprocket drive cushions?

I just checked them when I put the new tire on. Curious, how would that affect the chain tension?

 

[Crankthat]

I just checked them when I put the new tire on. Curious, how would that affect the chain tension?

The cushions do exactly as the name implies.
When they are still soft and pliable they cushion what would otherwise be a sharp jar every time you add or lower your throttle while changing gears.
They take stress away from the chain at those moments by cushioning the transition.

 

[bwanna]

The cushions do exactly as the name implies.
When they are still soft and pliable they cushion what would otherwise be a sharp jar every time you add or lower your throttle while changing gears.
They take stress away from the chain at those moments by cushioning the transition.

That's what I was assuming, but wanted to Madge sure. The rubber seemed appropriately pliable, but crashed, etc. Anything particular to look for?

 

[tkent02]

I haven't ever seen ny problems no matter how old they are, as long a they are still there. On bikes without cush drive hubs, the chains last a long time anyway. It's harder on spokes, and feels more harsh, but the chain can handle it.

 

[bwringer]

The video didn't work for me -- it's hosted on a pretty shady site and nothing much seemed to happen.

No one has brought this up yet, but I strongly suspect the problem is that the OP has a standard unsealed roller chain -- no o-rings or x-rings.

He can expect to re-adjust it every few hundred miles, and the chain will trash the sprockets so that both will wear out in a few thousand miles. Roller chains are false economy -- the cheapest option by far is an o-ring chain and new sprockets.

Bikemaster's generic o-ring and x-ring chains aren't the absolute finest you'd want to use on a turbo Hayabusa, but they'll work fine on a 450 for many many thousands of miles with no adjustments.



Secondly, I always cringe when someone mentions chain "tension". The chain should be under NO tension -- it should have a decent amount of slack, and it's far, far better to err on the side of too much slack. Too little slack trashes chains and perhaps even engines very quickly.

 

[bwanna]

This is frustrating. The chain loosened up again after only about 200 miles of mostly highway riding. I tensioned it with load and well lubricated. It went from the 3/4" play to about 1.5 - 2" of play. I noticed with this that it jingled a bit from the looseness in the rollers. This is a Bikemaster 530 non O ring chain and has not been used hard.

I just ordered a JT heavy duty x-ring chain.

Btw, the sprockets both look very good with no wear.

 

[tkent02]

This is a Bikemaster 530 non O ring chain and has not been used hard.

It has been used VERY hard, running too tight it MUCH harder on a chain than anything abusive you can do while riding. Many times as much force on the chain than doing burnouts or wheelies or anything else. Same with the bearings in the sprocket carrier and on the countershaft, they cannot take that amount of force for very long, they are not designed for it. There is no reason to, the entire system is designed to have some slack at all times. Learn to adjust the tension correctly before the new chain gets installed, or you will ruin it just as quickly as you have ruined this one. Slack in the chain is good, it is how they are meant to be run. The instant the slack is gone you are doing damage. Don't go there.