Ignitor Problems

[apogeecustom]

I almost have my machine up and running and I've run into spark issues. Plugs 2 and 3 aren't generating any spark. I've test the coils and wires with good plugs and they all work using wiring for 1 and 4. The signal generator tested out OK so I took out the ignitor to bench test.

Using a 12VDC wall wart power supply, some connectors, aligator clips etc. and a volt meter, I performed a test to check the operation of the ignitor. I applied possitive voltage to the O/W lead and negative voltage to the B/W lead. This should power the IC. Attaching my volt meter positive lead to +12VDC, I should be ablt to hook signal generator lead blue or green to -12DC and meter B/Y and W respectively to see the 12VDC circuit complete. Is this correct? What's happening instead is that when I hook the blue lead I end up with voltage on both B/Y and W, and when i swap to the green lead I get basically nothing.

I think I lost a transistor in the IC, or am I testing this incorrectly?
I would really like to not spend a bunch of bucks on an aftermarket, I don't want to take a chance on an Ebay replacement. Has anyone built one from Radio Shack parts before? I'd do it tonight if I could find a parts list and schematic.

Thanks.

 

[mike_of_bbg]

If you follow the link through BassCliff's site to Mr. Matchless's file list, there's a PDF there which discusses troubleshooting and repair of ignitor units. Never done it, have no feedback. YMMV.

Dyna S is ~$130.

 

[almarconi]

According to the service manual here is the Suzuki test method

Here is how to test your ignitor


Remove each spark plug of #3 and #4 cylinders, fit it
to the plug caps and place it on the cylinder head.

Remove the frame cover on the right side and disconnect the lead
wire from the signal generator.

Connect + lead of voltmeter (set on ohms) with blue lead
wire on the ignitor side and - lead on the voltmeter with the green
lead wire.
The moment the test pins are connected the spark plug of #4 sparks
and the moment the tester pins are disconnected the spark plug of
#3 cylinder sparks.

For a parts list look at this thread

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=156529

The guy that posted the list is a real nutjob so who know if it will work.

He had a picture of it on here, look here:

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=156546

 

[Guest]

Where's teddux and his homemade ignitor?
:evil:

 

[apogeecustom]

Where's teddux and his homemade ignitor?
:evil:

He already replied. Can't you see his post?

 

[almarconi]

Can't you see his post?

 

[mike_of_bbg]

I had him on my ignore list, and took him off to see what you were talking about. All I see is a picture: no schematic, board diagram, etc.

Now that I look, he's not in the member list any longer. Guess enough people got sick of him.

 

[apogeecustom]

Just a small joke related to the heated thread.

 

[almarconi]

Just a small joke related to the heated thread.

Ok..guess I missed that one. Guy was a real goof ball, vast majority of his posts made no sense.

 

[apogeecustom]

I just found another file on Mr. Matchless's site regarding other ignition modules; Bosch BIM024 and GM IM045. I just need to find some pricing on them to see if its worth while.

 

[apogeecustom]

So I'm thinking this could be a good fix for me. Looks like less than $50 for parts. Anyone have any thoughts on reliability? I wonder if these are using semiconductors or electro-mechanicl relays. Apparently its the same units used in a 78 Camero. Were there a lot of Cameros on the side of the road in 1978?

 

[Guest]

So I'm thinking this could be a good fix for me. Looks like less than $50 for parts. Anyone have any thoughts on reliability? I wonder if these are using semiconductors or electro-mechanicl relays. Apparently its the same units used in a 78 Camero. Were there a lot of Cameros on the side of the road in 1978?

They usually ended up in ditches or smashed into trees.

 

[Matchless]

So I'm thinking this could be a good fix for me. Looks like less than $50 for parts. Anyone have any thoughts on reliability? I wonder if these are using semiconductors or electro-mechanicl relays. Apparently its the same units used in a 78 Camero. Were there a lot of Cameros on the side of the road in 1978?

This does work, but is not mine. Lou the originator helped me fine tune it for the GS1000 which has 2 wires coming from the pickups. I have build a couple and a friend of mine rode around with one on loan for a while to prove his Igniter and had no problems. The heatsink for the Wells HEI modules is important. If you need more details around building one give me a PM anytime.
Keep well.

 

[apogeecustom]

This does work, but is not mine. Lou the originator helped me fine tune it for the GS1000 which has 2 wires coming from the pickups. I have build a couple and a friend of mine rode around with one on loan for a while to prove his Igniter and had no problems. The heatsink for the Wells HEI modules is important. If you need more details around building one give me a PM anytime.
Keep well.

I literally just finish building mine. Along with the coil relay mod, I'm getting very good spark. Regarding the heat sink, I mounted the two modules back to back, applied the included thermal grease, grounded a wire between the two using a spade and some #8 mounting screws as posts. I then used some galvanized strapping like you would use to mount air conditioning duct, in beweet the modules and it spans the frame under the seat. I electrical taped the ends of the strapping and zip tied it two each side of the frame. So now the modules are floating in air and the strapping will hopefull transfre some heat out of the way.

 

[Matchless]

Excellent - how is the bike running now?

 

[apogeecustom]

Excellent - how is the bike running now?

Well I just rebuilt mostly everything so I'm in the process of tuning it now. Ignition module was keeping me from getting to this point. Very upsetting. On the other hand, I think when I used to ride it two years ago, I was likely unknowingly working on just two cyclinders. I don't think I fried the module yesterday, and I don't think it died just by sitting outside for two years. So this is good news for me!

It started up after a while and whirled into 4K RPM! Must be that great spark! Thank God for kill switches. I'll report back in when I'm done, hopefully post some pics.

 

[salty_monk]

I use one of those modules on my Ford Falcon (1962) with a 200i Mustang engine in it & those modules generate a LOT of heat (depending on the resistance of the coils).
I use an MSD E core Coil which is a low resistance but with stock 3 ohm's I would think you will still get a decent amount of heat output....

I would want to at least mount them on a 1/4" thick sheet of Aluminium or put a large computer heatsink on one side or something... that's just me though!

Matchless - any thought on whether this could be modified to cope with the later electronic systems with electronic advance curve? Probably not at a guess... You'd have to retro fit a mechanical like you do for the Dyna S.

Dan

 

[apogeecustom]

Here's the installed unit. Second module is mounted below the visible one.
Works like a champ so far. Will put it through its paces as soon as the gas tank is done with treatment and my front brake master cylinder rebuild gets shipped

 

[Matchless]

I use one of those modules on my Ford Falcon (1962) with a 200i Mustang engine in it & those modules generate a LOT of heat (depending on the resistance of the coils).
I use an MSD E core Coil which is a low resistance but with stock 3 ohm's I would think you will still get a decent amount of heat output....

I would want to at least mount them on a 1/4" thick sheet of Aluminium or put a large computer heatsink on one side or something... that's just me though!

Matchless - any thought on whether this could be modified to cope with the later electronic systems with electronic advance curve? Probably not at a guess... You'd have to retro fit a mechanical like you do for the Dyna S.

Dan

Dan,
Unfortunately this approach only works with the mechanical advance type ignitions. You are 100% correct on all your comments and leaving your ignition switched on without the motor running for a long time can also cause overheating.

 

[brad-450Lz]

Just wondering how the HEI modules are hoding up. I've got a pair coming on monday ... has your heat sink been sufficient thus far? And how did you deal with the diodes and resistor? I'm thinking about soldering them on a very small piece of perf board and shrink wrapping it all in line with the leads ... I'd be curious to know how you did it.