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I've f%$#& had it with brakes

  • Thread starter Thread starter J_C
  • Start date Start date
What's a falcon??

I love garage days! I'm in!

Yeah, I agree lines are most likely not the issue. I still suspect that that 14mm mc isn't pushing enough fluid through, but I'll know for sure when I get the 5/8" mc on tomorrow.

I have brand new ferodo platinum pads I can't return (since I already opened the packages) that I put on yesterday, so I'm going to try like hell to make this work with my calipers. But I do love garage days =]

As for the lines, sounds like an awesome idea. Not sure your line would be long enough for the L though...
 
I'm pretty sure the offside would do your near side.... mine have a bit of slack in them anyhow. We can always have a measure up.

A Falcon:

IMGP4369D.jpg


This one is a 62 with an uprated engine (200ci), axle etc. Looks much better in the pic than in the flesh :D

Dan :)
 
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OOHHHHHH I definitely want to help on it (I'd love to use someone else's money for a change :D )


Yeah let's measure one of these days!
 
If money is a concern, Earl's (in Lawndale) is the way to go for the lines.

Hose is $2.99/foot x 5
Straight banjo - $7.04 each x 2
Angle banjo - $8.24 x 2

Whole thing should cost $50 with tax.

The guy at Earl's is pretty cool. You can ask him to crimp one straight banjo on each end of a piece of hose for you. That way you only need to cut the hose in half, and install an angled banjo on each end. Saves a little work. And please don't worry about the bolt on hose ends, they are MORE reliable than the bolt-on adapter ends that those Z1 Goodridge hoses use.

If it were me, I'd change the lines but I don't think that's the problem. Master is suspect to me.

Let me know if you need any help.:) I'm in for a garage day.:)
 
A trick I learned from my friend

A trick I learned from my friend

If your tryed everthing and no luck try this.
Lean or postion your bike so that the air has the straightest path to the M/C. Let your bike sit for 30 min. Then just tap the handle with your fingers. All you want is, To just barely move the piston back and fourth about 1/8 of an inch and the bubbles with come up throught the M/C. It will take some time but it works.
And one more thing the colder the lines are the better
 
My mc theory has been proven incorrect, as the 5/8 can still be pulled into the bar, unless double pumped. Almost positive its air free. Clean crystal clear fluid was coming out at the calipers. I tried cb's trick at the mc and did get some bubbles coming out for a time, but it stopped after a time. I did all the same tricks as before.

I have a hard time imagining it, but I suppose the lines could be causing this. Would it be worth a trip to earl's?


edit: yes I'm now so frusterated I'm willing to throw money at the problem to make it go away.
 
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J_C said:
My mc theory has been proven incorrect, as the 5/8 can still be pulled into the bar, unless double pumped. Almost positive its air free. Clean crystal clear fluid was coming out at the calipers. I tried cb's trick at the mc and did get some bubbles coming out for a time, but it stopped after a time. I did all the same tricks as before.

I have a hard time imagining it, but I suppose the lines could be causing this. Would it be worth a trip to earl's?


edit: yes I'm now so frusterated I'm willing to throw money at the problem to make it go away.
Click to expand...


Try working backwards from the caliper bleeders. First fill the MC then crack the banjo bolt. Now fit some clear hose over the left caliper bleeder with a squeeeze bottle full of brake fluid attached to it. Place some rag around the banjo area to protect your paint from the fluid. Open the bleeder and force the fluid into the caliper and back through the lines until clear fluid flows out the banjo opening. Repeat this on the right caliper. Tighten the MC banjo while the clear fluid is flowing. You have just completely eliminated air from the system from below the MC banjo, including the contensious tee fitting under the tree. Air likes to travel upwards so this system works a treat.

Check that the smaller of the two holes in the bottom of the MC reseviour is not blocked. This hole allows fluid to return from the line back to the MC after the brakes have been released. When blocked, air gets trapped foward of the piston and is difficult to expell. The blockage is not often apparant until you remove the brake lines.
It is also there to allow for natural expansion of the fluid within the brake system when the ambient temperatures rise significantly. Mine blocked and would cause the brakes to drag after the bike had been sitting in the sun all day.

Good luck.
 
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Jeff... hold on, can't be that bad & I don't believe you need new lines. You have new lines already. We can sort it out....

Dan :)
 
Thank you 49er. Chef had just told me about this method last evening on the phone. Looks like I'm going to be holding off on any work for now.......


Thx Dan. I'll wait. Hopefully they'll be good enough to get me to garage day.

I guess at this point I'm on to the last thing on my list (synching and tuning carbs).

Any idea on when we can have garage day? ;) I was hoping to get one last ride before I start my first year of Law School (which by all accounts in an unpleasant experience where time will be at a premium) but am realizing despite my best efforts this wont likely happen.
 
What is the condition of the calipers? Are they OEM and have you ever taken them apart to see if the pistons are moving freely? If you haven't taken the calipers apart yet, and it was me, I would do that. If for nothing else than to be sure of the condition they're in. The original lines can absorb a lot of pressure through expansion of the line. Have you held on to the brake line to see if you can feel any expansion when you're squeezing the lever? I'm just trying to come up with ideas on what you can do to narrow down where you need to focus your attention. If you're going to keep the bike for any length of time, it would be worth your while to swap out the OEM lines for SS anyway. And unless I missed it, did you replace the washers at the banjo bolts or reuse the old ones?

Don
 
Have you tried pumping with the MC cover on? It was the only way I was able to build pressure in a very recalcitrant brake system two summers ago. Fill the MC absolutely full (without overflowing when you put the cap on) and pump it that way. I was amazed at how quickly the system came up. This was after changing out the lines to braided steel, so it was a complete fill from empty. Also make compltely sure that any small secondary holes in the bottom of the MC are not plugged.
 
Hi Don,

I rebuilt the calipers (OEM). I just took them apart and replaced the piston seals to be sure it was working correctly, and I regreased the pins.

The washers I reused; they're solid brass washers.
 
I have been there, same frustation and also used different M/C's.
Finally I clamped a piece of pipe in the vice and bolted the M/C to it. Put an old banjo bolt on it with about 500 mm of clear pipe run straight up above the M/C, gave it a pump and waited then another and slowly all the air disappeared, then pointed the end into the reservoir, pumped and within a short while the stream was strong with no air, fitted it to the bike and bled normally and all was well.
The issue here seems to be that once you have cleaned it out properly and fitted it dry, it being higher than the brake line and calipers, and where the banjo is not right at the back of the M/C some air seems to get trapped and once that is out all is well.
Dont give up!
 
Hi roger, yes I've been pumping with the cover on. The system now has a minor bit of presure in it, it just still takes two pumps before I get a firm feel at the lever.
 
1. Did you replace the brake pads?

2. if not, did you put the old pads in the exact same spots they came out of?

3. was/is there a taper to the pad wear?
 
1. yes, brand new ferodo platinums
3. no, but as a result of the fact that one of the calipers was previously stuck, the side that was unstuck had pads with significantly more wear
 
I remember going through the voodoo brake master cylinder dance and only to realize the amount of time I wasted on junk.

I bought a new OEM Honda master, never bench bled the unit; simply installed, pumped hard as a rock in two pumps after filling reservoir, I bled at caliper, and all was well.

You have to ask yourself, what's your life worth? Brakes are not an option and you only get one chance to live. The five days you spent at night trying to revive a corpse of a master when you could have been out riding just isn't worth it; to me it certainly isn't.

Either rebuild the master or bite the bullet and get a new one. Worst case you retro-fit.
 
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