Oz GS1000 resto and GSX1100 cafe builds

[blackhammer]

I believe that tank is the larger of the 2 styles that came on the 80-82 GSX1100ET.

 

[blackhammer]

Well, Chuck, as usual some outstanding info/research there... Ive seen that table on the VTR forums and it formed the basis of my plans to upgrade to 600F4i calipers, alot of the VTR guys that do that upgrade just use the VTR M/C, and thats what i was intending to do, might look at 15/16mm ones if i can find one cheap.

Excellent info on the forks, much appreciated that you share it. Not exactly sure what i will do with mine yet.

With the speedo send unit i have gone down the delete road...like John suggested it was easier to go with an electronic dash. I was initially all about the classic look with gauges etc, but my tastes have taken more of a turn towards the modern minimalist side of things. Added a pic below to show the new top triple i had made up with the instrument integrated.

In terms of the standard speedo sender i dont think it is possible to mod it, looking at initially i thought it may be possible, but once you remove the drive cover there just isnt any way to get 20mm out of it.

Having a look around on the interwebs tho there does seem to be quite a few 20mm axle speedo drives around, some of the early GSXR's used 20mm axle i believe, maybe you can make one of those work? Gearing may be an issue if you are going to use a standard 19" wheel.

New top triple:

got my new rear shocks:

 

[John Kat]

Well, Chuck, as usual some outstanding info/research there... Ive seen that table on the VTR forums and it formed the basis of my plans to upgrade to 600F4i calipers, alot of the VTR guys that do that upgrade just use the VTR M/C, and thats what i was intending to do, might look at 15/16mm ones if i can find one cheap.

Excellent info on the forks, much appreciated that you share it. Not exactly what i will do with mine yet.

With the speedo send unit i have gone down the delete road...like John suggested it was easier to go with an electronic dash. I was initially all about the classic look with gauges etc, but my tastes have taken more of a turn towards the modern minimalist side of things. Added a pic below to show the new top triple i had made up with the instrument integrated.

In terms of the standard speedo sender i dont think it is possible to mod it, looking at initially i thought it may be possible, but once you remove the drive cover there just isnt any way to get 20mm out of it.

Having a look around on the interwebs tho there does seem to be quite a few 20mm axle speedo drives around, some of the early GSXR's used 20mm axle i believe, maybe you can make one of those work? Gearing may be an issue if you are going to use a standard 19" wheel.

New top triple:

got my new rear shocks:

Beautifull top triple!
Are the shocks from YSS?
What's the model number?

 

[Chuck78]

YSS makes some of the best shocks for the money these days for sure... yes, they are YSS.

Nice triple! Looked at my VTR forks a bit & measured. Yes, the spokes are close to the calipers with stock triples, but they clear. I may go with the 6 piston gsxr1000 calipers as the smaller pistons will give more clearance, but I think some Discaciatti Racing 4 pots are a little more slender as well but $$$$$$$.

 

[blackhammer]

Yeh, rz366's. Definitely the best shock/features for the money. I contemplated ikon (had koni's over the years) and hagon for a long time, but gas and ride hight adjustment won the day.
Also when ordering the guys at YSS were really good to chat too, had the shocks 3 days after ordering.

No room in my budget for the Discaciatti's they look fantastic tho... ive picked up a set of 600F4i twin pistons to try (50$), i'll keep an eye out for the 6 pots, but much like the RC51 calipers they seem hard to find down here.

 

[Chuck78]

Yeh, rz366's. Definitely the best shock/features for the money

RZ? You mean Z366? Great shock. The Z362-TRL is probably the best good shock for the money @ $499... 366 has larger shaft, 16mm vs their base/standard 12mm
@$599 the G302 has piggyback & 60 clicks rebound adjustment but 30 or 32mm piston, still a fantastic bargain. E-302 is same but no external dampening adjustment, best budget piggyback on the market @ under $500.
@$769 the G362TRCL has adjustable compression & rebound. @ $1069 you get an all Billet machined G362TRWL with 60 clicks rebound plus high speed AND low speed compression adjustment... less $ than Ohlins & more features. $1200 if you get the 16mm shaft version with those features, same price as Ohlins but way better...

I'm hoping for another vintage pair of piggybacks - Fox Factory Shox, Ohlins, or Works for the Rickman build, but if new shocks, they will surely be YSS.

No room in my budget for the Discaciatti's they look fantastic tho... ive picked up a set of 600F4i twin pistons to try (50$).

Same here... very nice but $400/ea! The cbr600f4i calipers are one of the top 2 or 4 picks in the 4 piston nissin/tokico range. I think I need the 6 piston 01-02 gsxr calipers to utilize their large overall piston area with smaller diameter pistons so that I can clear my spokes better. Looks to be very tight with the stock vtr calipers, 1 or 1.4mm maybe of clearance to spokes. Castings are supposedly 6mm thick however, slight room for angle milling at bottom inside piston area to clearance more.

The GSXR Tokico's mostly come in gold, where the Nissin's mostly black. Largest volume in Nissin is the RC51 SP1 (?) & CBR600F4I @ 34mm/32mm pistons. The best in the Tokico 4 pistons are 34mm/30mm pistons. The 6 pot gsxr's are similar in piston area to those, very trick looking, but prone to stiff piston operation if pistons are not cleaned once or twice a season.

I'm going to stick with the stock vtr triples for now I think. If I really have trouble with caliper clearance, I can swap to some gsxr or sv650 triples @ 195 to 200mm (vtr is 192mm), but will need to get that x-y vise setup to run a collet holder and end mill bits in my drill press to machine a wider center section to the Coerce fork brace I plan to run. Hope to get a small to medium lathe also to turn my own rotor spacers and adapters.

There's a lot of good info on fork swaps on VFR forums, as they swap vtr1000 forks since the vtr & vfr are 2 models which use forks that are actually similar in height to our vintage bikes. The vfr uses 2 piston calipers & 296mm rotors which work plenty good, but owners upgrade them to vtr's sometimes solely to get the 4 piston caliper mounts even. Plus Racetech makes great cartridges for them.



The VFR forks that have external rebound adjustment and 2 piston calipers now seem to me to be the other best option for our bikes, easier clearance for spokes but not the absolute ultimate in brakes though, just really good brakes.

I seem to think I recall vfr discussions about one CBR fork that was taller as well, but it slips my mind.

 

[blackhammer]

I may even leave the VTR calipers on mine in the long run, they are in near new condition. The VTR guys complain about them, but the difference over our old GS setups will still be immense.
The VTR guys also like to complain about the forks ive noticed on the forums

The clearance issues with the calipers were a major concern for me, that's why i stuck with the GK spacing and bottom triple.. Interested to see how you go with the for brace, ive been contemplating how im going to achieve that task..

 

[Chuck78]

I think the vtr calipers will clear better with stock triples than the f4i's, but with your gk triples, I think you'll be fine regardless.

I took some gs hub and superhawk fork/brake measurements this AM. With the 32mm offset(EDIT: 23mm offset, typo) 599 Hornet rotors, I'll only need to bump up my GS-ninja caliper rotor spacer up from 5mm thick (17mm offset cbr rotor on gs forks & 2 piston calipers) to 7.25mm thick to get to the centers of the superhawk calipers. I might wait to get the gsxr calipers before I have the parts made, make sure they are dead on the same spec, but should be.

Here's the 5mm thick version for cbr rotors on gs forks with ninja/gs500 calipers:

 

[blackhammer]

Its been a merry old Xmas... and because i know everyone likes pics here's what's made me merry.

got my wheels back, very pleased with the outcome. Rims are 17x4.5 rear 18x2.5 front

Then got myself some rubber, 150 rears 110 front

On the bike

150 is a comfortable fit in the swinger and chain clears by a mile.

Spokes clear the calipers by plenty as well up front, so now im busy getting all the spacing worked out for the discs.
Also have a 16cell antigravity to try and squeeze under the seat..
Feel like i might get a ride in this summer

 

[blackhammer]

Now, to search function my way to a rear disc/caliper upgrade!

 

[steve murdoch]

Love the look of the wheels, Nate.
What brand tires did you go with?

 

[Chuck78]

I know everyone likes pics, here's what's made me merry.

150 is a comfortable fit in the swinger and chain clears by a mile.

Nate,......WOW!!!!! Your bike is looking magnificent!!! What an awesome build! The tank, the YSS shocks on the GS1100E swingarm, the forks... All superb, very tastefully selected, and very serious on drastically improved functionality!

Love the look of the wheels, Nate.
What brand tires did you go with?

Looks like only the grippiest available, Pirelli Sport Demons! GS hubs and I'm going to guess Excel Takasago rims?

I did not have any luck here stateside finding a 150/70-18 Pirelli Sport Demon, must only be available in a 17" rim, bummer. Only Avon AM26 RoadRiders come in a 150/70/18 for the rears of our bikes, which I am running with very little clearance to the chain with standard spaced sprockets (Avon tires typically run wider than other brands). I can see where the chain has slapped the edge of the tread&sidewall many times on mine during times when the chain sways side to side on the slack side of it. 140/70 is a great choice technically speaking but the 150 looks the most appropriate and fitting on a vintage bike, the 140/70 is not quite as tall of a profile, looks quite thin, a bit on the modern side. Less weight & less sidewall flex, however.

EDIT: the GS1150 came with a very sought after GS double 3 spoke mag wheel in a 3.50x17 (& 3.00x17???), which many members have swapped onto other GS's. They always run into extra work trying to properly re-space the rear wheel for centering and chain alignment, so perhaps the 1150 output countershaft sprocket is moved outboard slightly to utilize this later/wider GS rear wheel and a 130 rear tire??? Better check your chain alignment with a string of ProfiCAT laser beam chain alignment tool. just to be certain.

Great work!

 

[Chuck78]

Now, to search function my way to a rear disc/caliper upgrade!

http://metalgear.com.au/mgear-brake-disc-front-gold-centre-p-11052.html

Run these 275mm 22mm offset Katana front rotors in place of the heavy GS 23mm offset 275mm rears. Only difference is these run 10mm bolts. Maybe you can drill&tap your rear hubs larger, but I just used a steel snowflake pattern GS rotor as a template and drill pressed the 8mm hole pattern in between the 10mm hole pattern. Same bolt pattern 78mm 6 bolt, same 56mm inner hub bore diameter.

The rear caliper run on the GS650G and others is slightly lighter than a 750/1100 77-81+ caliper& a direct bolt on.

A new AP Racing or old AP Lockheed rear caliper would be lightest of this style and very trick looking but may require a custom hanger bracket. Look at my Rickman thread on dotheton.com or caferacers.net for a link to their product page EDIT: Here is the hard to find page with the most info on the calipers and rebuild parts for the new& old classic calipers: http://api.viglink.com/api/click?fo...4%20Product%20Catalogue/2014%20Motorcycle.pdf

Their modern Billet rear caliper is just amazing, but underslung configuration that would require relocation of the brake stay mount currently welded to the top of your swingarm, & it's $$$.

The rotor I linked is the only "bolt-on" good easy solution for an upgrade, & the gs650 caliper is the cheapest caliper option. I went with a GS1150E caliper but it required much fab work for a custom brake stay arm.

 

[John Kat]

Looks fantastic!
Keep up the good work.
FYI another good set of tires in the size you need are the Conti Classic Road Attack 2 CR.
These are fully modern radial tires developped specifically for the period racers that are limited to a 150 width on the rear here in France.
I don't race them but the grip is very good.
A local racer has both the Pirelli's you have and the Conti's.
No preference eitheir way from what he told me.

 

[Chuck78]

Great to know John, thanks for the tip!

 

[steve murdoch]

I am very happy with the 150/70-18 Bridgestone BT45 i have on my spoked wheel Honda.
Great grip, decent wear.

 

[John Kat]

Nate,......WOW!!!!! Your bike is looking magnificent!!! What an awesome build! The tank, the YSS shocks on the GS1100E swingarm, the forks... All superb, very tastefully selected, and very serious on drastically improved functionality!



Looks like only the grippiest available, Pirelli Sport Demons! GS hubs and I'm going to guess Excel Takasago rims?

I did not have any luck here stateside finding a 150/70-18 Pirelli Sport Demon, must only be available in a 17" rim, bummer. Only Avon AM26 RoadRiders come in a 150/70/18 for the rears of our bikes, which I am running with very little clearance to the chain with standard spaced sprockets (Avon tires typically run wider than other brands). I can see where the chain has slapped the edge of the tread&sidewall many times on mine during times when the chain sways side to side on the slack side of it. 140/70 is a great choice technically speaking but the 150 looks the most appropriate and fitting on a vintage bike, the 140/70 is not quite as tall of a profile, looks quite thin, a bit on the modern side. Less weight & less sidewall flex, however.

EDIT: the GS1150 came with a very sought after GS double 3 spoke mag wheel in a 3.50x17 (& 3.00x17???), which many members have swapped onto other GS's. They always run into extra work trying to properly re-space the rear wheel for centering and chain alignment, so perhaps the 1150 output countershaft sprocket is moved outboard slightly to utilize this later/wider GS rear wheel and a 130 rear tire??? Better check your chain alignment with a string of ProfiCAT laser beam chain alignment tool. just to be certain.

Great work!

Chuck,

I have mounted the 3.5 wheel on my 1100 Kat and you are right the engine sprocket has to be moved out a little.
In fact the OEM spacer behind the sprocket on the 1150 is slightly longer than on the other GS's.
Here's a picture or two.
The tire is a 130/80 that goes to 150 due to the larger rim.
The brake stay is slightly modified to take that into account.

 

[Chuck78]

Chuck,

I have mounted the 3.5 wheel on my 1100 Kat and you are right the engine sprocket has to be moved out a little.
In fact the OEM spacer behind the sprocket on the 1150 is slightly longer than on the other GS's.
Here's a picture or two.
The tire is a 130/80 that goes to 150 due to the larger rim.
The brake stay is slightly modified to take that into account.

So for Nate with the 1150 engine and heating that he has more than adequate chain clearance on a 150 tire, I'd venture to say that he needs to use stock wheel spacers for a GS750/1000 rear wire spoke hub, but he will likely need to add some flat aluminum sheet spacer material behind his rear sprocket between it and the cush drive carrier hub, since he needs that tire clearance that the 1150 engine's further outboard spaced countershaft sprocket is giving him...

Thanks for the confirmation, John!

 

[blackhammer]

Thanks for the kind words Chuck, John, Steve..

Honestly Chuck, the research you have done and the info you have posted has helped me alot, im not sure i can say i wouldve gone with the VTR forks if i hadnt read your posts. As for the rims, unsure what they are, will ask the wheel builder what brand he used, they weren't very cheap tho! $$$ Im very happy with how the wheels came out though.

Thanks for the info on the rear caliper upgrade, not sure what i will do with that yet, none of the GSX1100 alloy wheel spacers seem correct, everything was out on my trial fit, i think i may shift the caliper down and break stay to under the swing arm and get all new custom spacers.. Just looking at a few options now and will let you know how i go...
I'll grab a photo with the chain on shortly showing the chain clearance.

 

[Weasel]

Build is coming along beautifully. Very nice work and attention to detail.