1982 GS1100 Front Brakes arent making pressure

[Guest]

Hi, I was recently redoing my 82 Gs1100's brakes and after all is said and done, i cant get pressure to build in the system. I rebuilt both front brakes, as well as installed new brake pistons and replaced the brake pads. I replaced my old rubber lines with stainless steel lines. I was thinking maybe it was the master cylinder, but when i pulled that out (and noticed i had the wrong rebuild kit) it looked perfectly fine. I even filled it up with fluid and manually pumped it and was able to build some pressure with my thumb on the whole. However, i noticed that when i pumped the M/C, fluid would shoot out of the exit hole in the reservoir, and i mean like properly shoot out, a good 4-5 inches. Is this normal, or do i just need to keep searching and get the right rebuild kit?
Any advice is greatly appreciated!!

Also, forgot to add, it does build *some* pressure, but its only right as it reaches the grip.

 

[Rich82GS750TZ]

There are 2 holes in the bottom of the reservoir. One is really tiny. Did you make sure they’re both clear? (Pic is before I cleaned it)

 

[Guest]

There are 2 holes in the bottom of the reservoir. One is really tiny. Did you make sure they’re both clear? (Pic is before I cleaned it)

Yes, my reservoir is actually really clean. i can see both holes clearly and they are pretty clean.

 

[Gorminrider]

Air in the line is a common nuisance here when bleeding the lines. You will find lots of similar posts in this thread with multiple solutions...If you follow the manuals bleeding instruction, I find it still helps to get a syringe and suck air/fluid/bubbles from the "tiny hole"while moving the handlever in between... There seems to be a bubble that can build up there seeing as air bubbles want to move upward. Tapping the line might help get these bubbles up but perhaps they are getting trapped at 90 degree course changes...at the union for twin calipers and up at the master.

Another option is to use a pump or a large syringe to pump the fluid upward from the calipers. Some say just tying the lever halfway overnight does the trick.

 

[rphillips]

Hey Flordia, just wondering the brand of the wrong rebuild kit?? A few yrs. back I bought a front kit, for my "83" GS1100E from "All Balls", appx. half parts were incorrect & the other half were correct. Good luck with the fluid, sometimes really aggravating.

 

[Cipher]

The fluid shooting out is from the return I assume mine does this and works fine.

 

[Guest]

Hey Flordia, just wondering the brand of the wrong rebuild kit?? A few yrs. back I bought a front kit, for my "83" GS1100E from "All Balls", appx. half parts were incorrect & the other half were correct. Good luck with the fluid, sometimes really aggravating.

Its a K&L rebuild hit. I got it from Z1 Enterprises. It looks completely wrong, as i took out my master cylinder and then looked at the kit and nothing rly matched.

 

[Guest]

Air in the line is a common nuisance here when bleeding the lines. You will find lots of similar posts in this thread with multiple solutions...If you follow the manuals bleeding instruction, I find it still helps to get a syringe and suck air/fluid/bubbles from the "tiny hole"while moving the handlever in between... There seems to be a bubble that can build up there seeing as air bubbles want to move upward. Tapping the line might help get these bubbles up but perhaps they are getting trapped at 90 degree course changes...at the union for twin calipers and up at the master.

Another option is to use a pump or a large syringe to pump the fluid upward from the calipers. Some say just tying the lever halfway overnight does the trick.

So i left the brakes depressed overnight, and it was a little firmer but still, it just wasnt building enough pressure. I even re-bled the calipers and master cylinder and still wouldnt build more pressure. I took my screwdriver and gave everything some very loving love taps.

 

[Guest]

On a quick note, ive noticed my brakes move when i press on them. As in the whole caliper moves. Is that normal or is that the problem?

 

[Guest]

Its a K&L rebuild hit.

There's your problem. I would only go OEM on brake components, they are too critical to trust to flaky aftermarket companies. You don't say which 1100 model you have, but you want the 'Cup Set, Master' or 'Piston Cup Set', depending on which model you have. For the E it is part #59600-49831. For the G and GL models it is #59600-45831. It may cost a bit more than aftermarket, but it will be OEM quality and the correct parts that will work properly with no issues.

I even re-bled the calipers and master cylinder and still wouldnt build more pressure.

So, your lines are full of fluid and you can move fluid through them as per usual when bleeding the brakes except no pressure builds? Have you tried vacuum bleeding them or filling from the bottom with a large syringe?

On a quick note, ive noticed my brakes move when i press on them. As in the whole caliper moves. Is that normal or is that the problem?

That is normal. There is only a piston on one side of the caliper and the body slides on the pins to clamp the far side brake pad onto the rotor as the piston pushes on the near side brake pad.


Mark

 

[Guest]

There's your problem. I would only go OEM on brake components, they are too critical to trust to flaky aftermarket companies. You don't say which 1100 model you have, but you want the 'Cup Set, Master' or 'Piston Cup Set', depending on which model you have. For the E it is part #59600-49831. For the G and GL models it is #59600-45831. It may cost a bit more than aftermarket, but it will be OEM quality and the correct parts that will work properly with no issues.




So, your lines are full of fluid and you can move fluid through them as per usual when bleeding the brakes except no pressure builds? Have you tried vacuum bleeding them or filling from the bottom with a large syringe?




That is normal. There is only a piston on one side of the caliper and the body slides on the pins to clamp the far side brake pad onto the rotor as the piston pushes on the near side brake pad.


Mark

I tried both reverse bleeding and vacuum bleeding. I was able to push up some old fluid from the T section I think, but no air. Could my banjo bolts be causing the problem. One of them has a slight leak, but it?s only when I pressure it over night. I wasn?t able to replace them as I didn?t know where to get the right bolts from. My stainless steel kit came with the wrong ones. As for rebuilding the calibers again with an own kit, I used the oem Suzuki seals that came with my new pistons. My bike is a 1100G

 

[Gorminrider]

The fluid shooting out is from the return I assume mine does this and works fine.

It sounds from your posts that things are improving so ,working from the assumption that all else is GOOD, that's when I use the syringe there...squeeze brake lever slowly to halfway-2/3ds, suck fluid out of tiny hole with it, repeat....I'm usually suprised by the air bubbles that show up after a few tries....

if this is the "cure", the brake lever hardens up as you get some bubbles out.

You mention the banjo bolts...and washers? Can you use the old ones? I do.

 

[Guest]

It sounds from your posts that things are improving so ,working from the assumption that all else is GOOD, that's when I use the syringe there...squeeze brake lever slowly to halfway-2/3ds, suck fluid out of tiny hole with it, repeat....I'm usually suprised by the air bubbles that show up after a few tries....

if this is the "cure", the brake lever hardens up as you get some bubbles out.

You mention the banjo bolts...and washers? Can you use the old ones? I do.

One of the banjo bolts has a very small leak. When i leave the break depressed over night it has a few drops come out. so ive ordered a new banjo bolt as well as some seal-o-washers to see if i can get it to stop. The copper ones that came with my braided lines didnt seem to do the trick. As for the other banjo bolts i re-used them and just ran some carb cleaner because of all the rust in the lines. Imma gonna spend a few hours trying to bleed my breaks again and see if i can get the brakes tight enough to be able to ride.

 

[Guest]

One of the banjo bolts has a very small leak. When i leave the break depressed over night it has a few drops come out. so ive ordered a new banjo bolt as well as some seal-o-washers to see if i can get it to stop. The copper ones that came with my braided lines didnt seem to do the trick. As for the other banjo bolts i re-used them and just ran some carb cleaner because of all the rust in the lines. Imma gonna spend a few hours trying to bleed my breaks again and see if i can get the brakes tight enough to be able to ride.

I put a new master cylinder assembly on, as well as new washers. I even used the seal washers to see if I could get a better seal. Still, the T-Section of my brake lines leaks like crazy, and I still can?t seem to build full brake pressure. I don?t feel pressure until about half way down the lever. I vacuum bled them to make sure air was out of the system, and still nothing. I don?t understand

 

[Guest]

I know i might be just talking to myself at this point, but a lot of post i see dont ever rap up or conclude. I tested each caliper individually by hooking up the old brake assembly to see if they would build pressure. It looks like either the double banjo or T joint is allowing pressure to leak. I just wanted to say thank you to everyone who helped me and gave me advice, you guys are a foundation to my restoration!

 

[Gorminrider]

I'm starting to wonder if the T joint is cracked where the banjo bolts thread in?....or something is stopping the banjo end and washers from mating to flat surfaces? because It's not my experience that the banjo bolts or washers in themselves are at all difficult to seal.

It's more difficult with twin discs but you might have better accessibility if you remove the t joint from it's mount and even replumb the system so it's out where you can see all round it properly.

You can even remove the entire system to the bench, putting clean thickness of wood in to replace the discs...

 

[dorkburger]

Regarding the master cylinder. I usually get the noted tiny bubbles from the hole. When this happens I slowly work the lever in and out, but only go about 1/2 - 3/4 of the way in. I keep the cap off to observe and go slow to prevent the "fountain". There is often a surprising amount of tiny bubbles released.

 

[Guest]

I'm starting to wonder if the T joint is cracked where the banjo bolts thread in?....or something is stopping the banjo end and washers from mating to flat surfaces? because It's not my experience that the banjo bolts or washers in themselves are at all difficult to seal.

It's more difficult with twin discs but you might have better accessibility if you remove the t joint from it's mount and even replumb the system so it's out where you can see all round it properly.

You can even remove the entire system to the bench, putting clean thickness of wood in to replace the discs...

Im not sure but when i took the crush washers off, they were pretty crushed. I could clearly see where they sealed. Im thinking there is something in the connector thats not allowing it to build pressure. There was a decent amount of rust in the old lines and i wanna say some pretty good rust in the T as well, so the threads might have become too worn to properly seal. Thats just my guess however.

 

[Gorminrider]

The old washers must have been squeezed on pretty tight. Hope the threads arent stripped...They needn't be flattened to seal. Just tight (if you are prone to yarding on bolts, try a torque wrench if you have it ...)
If the threads were leaking, the washers should stop any leaks anyways if the surface of the T is flat and reasonably smooth. If the banjos tighten ok it shouldn't leak.

On some bikes, the T has an indentation to limit the angle of a brakeline attached to it. That'd be worth a look just to see if the metal end of the brakeline isn't hanging up on a ridge that controls that angle or even on backwards with the angled end hung up stopping a seal ... On my bikes with dualcalipers, I cant see much for cables, forks,wiring...that's why I suggested getting the T out where you can see it closely.

 

[Guest]

Guys, i am really starting to get fed up. There is NO logical reason that these brakes shouldnt be building pressure. Both calipers will pressure, both master cylinders work, put it all together, IT WONT WORK. I tried a new tee, still nothing. I reversed bled, i took the whole thing off the bike and held the calipers over the M/C, STILL NOTHING. This bike just doesnt want to stop! I dont even know if any of the shops around me would be willing to even look at them because they are too old.