forgot to bench sync, idiot....

[indyjoel]

I have put some questions in bold.
What I have done so far

Cleaned and dipped the carbs and put them on back on the bike.

Was having trouble starting the bike so I thought I would take the carbs off to check again.

Realised that I forgot to adjust the throttle plates. They were totally closed.

Will that make the bike near impossible to start and idle?

Then I put new orings in the air screws (just to be sure) but I found one of the air screw washers bent. I now need a new washer.

Does anyone know the part number for that as I could not see it on the parts diagram?

Are the air screws supposed to be semi difficult to screw in or extremely easy to screw in?

Then I put new orings in the carb joiner pipes but they were not quite right so I need to order new orings as well.

Oh well when it rains it pours....

 

[almarconi]

Will that make the bike near impossible to start and idle?

Yes

Does anyone know the part number for that as I could not see it on the parts diagram?

Don't have a clue of the part number. You could try posting in the parts wanted section, some one would probably be willing to post a couple to you.

Are the air screws supposed to be semi difficult to screw in or extremely easy to screw in?

They should screw in relatively easily. There is a spring in there so you will have some resistance.

 

[Suzuki_Don]

Yes Joe,

If the throttle plates are closed the bike will not idle. That is why you adjust the idle speed with the throttle stop screw (the large thumb screw) under the carbs to open the throttle plates to a point where the motor will idle.

Are you saying that you did a carb dip and didn't replace the carb "O" rings (BAD BOY). You gotta do it RIGHT the first time. Or you will need to do it a second time. As you will have by now realised. Replace all the "O" rings in the carbs, every single one. Replace the intake stub "O" rings as well. You can get them from "Cycleorings.com". They will only take about a week and a half to get to you. And the cost is very reasonable.

Didn't you pull the mixture screws out when you did the carb dip? There's an "O" ring in there too.

 

[Matchless]

I have never been able to buy those small washers, but have made up a few. Bundle a couple of stainless washers with the correct ID on a bolt and tighten them down, then carefully grind the tube of washers to get the correct OD, smooth the edges with some sand paper.
If you get some for sale somewhere let us know please.

 

[piester]

Im sure i have some extras laying around if ya want some

 

[indyjoel]

Im sure i have some extras laying around if ya want some

Piester

can you send me two or three if you have them please.

Let me know the cost and I will forward.

I will PM you the address if ok

 

[Guest]

If the throttle plates are closed there will no vacuum to suck the fuel out of the main jet which is diverted to the pilot jet when the jet needle is in the main.
So no, it will not start.

 

[mike_of_bbg]

If you buy a full set of carb rebuild o-rings at cycleorings.com (including the fuel rails), he can sell you the idle screw washers too. About $1/pkg. 2 IIRC.

 

[1_v8_merc]

****, i just did the EXACT same thing!(bench sync)

Now i gotta pull those ****in carbs out AGAIN......
I knew i was forgetting something.

I wonder if I can do this with the carbs half-way out?

Actually, im wondering if that's why my bike had so much trouble idling in the first place!
(the owner before me forget to bench sync it?)

 

[Guest]

I don't see why you couldn't bench sync with the airbox removed.

 

[Guest]

****, i just did the EXACT same thing!(bench sync)

Now i gotta pull those ****in carbs out AGAIN......
I knew i was forgetting something.

I wonder if I can do this with the carbs half-way out?

Actually, im wondering if that's why my bike had so much trouble idling in the first place!
(the owner before me forget to bench sync it?)

I'd try and see if it starts. You might get it to run good enough to do a vacuum synch (assuming you have a carb synch tool).

 

[1_v8_merc]

I'd try and see if it starts. You might get it to run good enough to do a vacuum synch (assuming you have a carb synch tool).

You're saying to just try and crank it over even without benching it?
If i can get the bike to idle somewhat, will a vacuum sync over-ride everything so i don't have to go back and bench it?

What should I do with the Choke when starting the bike up for the first time?


But yes, i just bought a brand new carb sync kit, so that's ready to go.

 

[Guest]

If everything is installed (airbox ect) prime the float bowls (see prime on petcock), open the choke the whole way and without touching the throttle crank the starter.

 

[Guest]

You're saying to just try and crank it over even without benching it?
If i can get the bike to idle somewhat, will a vacuum sync over-ride everything so i don't have to go back and bench it?

If you didn't disturb the synch screws when you took the carbs apart, they will still be close. Bench synching just gets them close enough to run so that you can vacuum synch them.

 

[1_v8_merc]

Thanks Chef, that cleared it up for me.

Reno: Nah, i didn't touch the screws at all. But i remember the butterflys being pretty close to the bottom, i do remember shinning a flashlight and seeing alittle light coming thru the bottom, but I still think they may be alittle tight! But I hope im wrong! Because like I said, the bike had an Idling problem, and I was just wondering if it could have been due to the last guy not Benching it, although he would have had to sync it, which should have fixed it.....im just being stupid and paranoid!

Im gonna hook the gas tank and try to fire her up, enough of me blabbering,

Thanks a bunch guys

 

[waterman]

You're saying to just try and crank it over even without benching it?
If i can get the bike to idle somewhat, will a vacuum sync over-ride everything so i don't have to go back and bench it?

What should I do with the Choke when starting the bike up for the first time?


But yes, i just bought a brand new carb sync kit, so that's ready to go.

The vacuum snych is going to be more precise than the bench synch. Essentially, the bench sync is to get the motor to run, the vacuum synch will tune the carbs to the engines demands.

Go ahead and "choke" the engine to start, most likely will not start otherwise.

Typically, I will get engine up to operating temp and then go about a vacuum synch while running a fan to help cool engine. I think for the 650 they recommend 1750 rpm engine speed for vacuum sync.

 

[Guest]

Reno: Nah, i didn't touch the screws at all. But i remember the butterflys being pretty close to the bottom, i do remember shinning a flashlight and seeing alittle light coming thru the bottom, but I still think they may be alittle tight!

Screwing in the idle knob opens them up.

 

[Guest]

You also need to make sure the main idle adjustment has the butterflies open a wee bit so air can enter the carb throat.

 

[1_v8_merc]

Alrite guys, im having trouble getting her to fire up, it just keeps cranking.

I've got my tank on a seperate stand with extended fuel lines.
I think I have the tank high enough, since it's gravity fed. I have a secondary fuel filter installed, and i can see the fuel bubbling and moving down the line.

I have the choke wide open.
I turned the main Idle adjustment knob underneath the carbs In a little bit.
I also turned the Air Screws out about 1 1/2 turns.
(im having a problem with the 4th screw, it's stuck and stripped pretty bad, although last time I turned it, it was pretty loose, so hopefully it's alrite for now......)

Here's my main question guys.
How long does it take for enough fuel to get into the float bowls before you start getting the engine to run?

Because, i've been crankin it for a while now, and fuel keeps moving thru the filter, but it's not starting.

Should I try giving it some more throttle/gas or what?

 

[Steve]

Quoting from v8 merc, then responding:

I've got my tank on a seperate stand with extended fuel lines.
I think I have the tank high enough, since it's gravity fed.
Your remote tank should be about the same height as your standard tank.

I have a secondary fuel filter installed, and i can see the fuel bubbling and moving down the line.
If possible, get rid of the filter. You already have a filter on the petcock, nothing should be getting past that.

I have the choke wide open.
What are you calling "wide open"? I believe you have a lever under the left handgrip?
Lever to the RIGHT is the OFF position, where it should be when riding.
Pulling the lever to the LEFT engages the "choke" for starting.

I turned the main Idle adjustment knob underneath the carbs In a little bit.
I also turned the Air Screws out about 1 1/2 turns.
They are not "air screws", they are "Idle mixture adjustment screws" and should be turned out another turn. Start with them between 2 1/2 and 3 turns out. After the bike is warm, fine-tune them using the highest-idle method.

(im having a problem with the 4th screw, it's stuck and stripped pretty bad, although last time I turned it, it was pretty loose, so hopefully it's alrite for now......)

Here's my main question guys.
How long does it take for enough fuel to get into the float bowls before you start getting the engine to run?
If the carbs were TOTALLY DRY, maybe a minute, usually less.

Because, i've been crankin it for a while now, and fuel keeps moving thru the filter, but it's not starting.
As mentioned earlier, get rid of the filter, if possible.

Should I try giving it some more throttle/gas or what?
While trying to start the engine, especially if using the "choke", do NOT touch the throttle.