Oz GS1000 resto and GSX1100 cafe builds

[Guest]

Mate she's looking good, great stuff! And yeah I'm jealous of your blast cabinet... wish I had the space for one!

 

[blackhammer]

Yeh, made the cabinet big enough to fit frames, definitely saving cash and time doing my own blasting.

 

[T8erbug]

How long are those VTR forks from top clamping area to wheel axle center? I'm looking into some new forks for my GS1000 and I've been hearing a lot about them. Ground clearance is my only concern. I want the bike to stay as close to stock height as possible but I'll be going from a 19" wheel to a 18" or 17". I'll need some longer forks to compensate. I was looking at VRF forks but I hate those stupid anti-dive modulators. Your bike is looking great BTW

 

[John Kat]

Looking at the TNK site ( http://www.tnk.it/en/prodotti3.php?...S LIKE ORIGINAL&cart=0050035&mp=TNK GROUP SRL)
the VTR fork tubes alone are 633 mm long for the VTR 1000 and 595 mm for the GS 1000.
As they are 41 mm in diameter they would fit into the triple tree of the GSXR 1100 first gen.
Looks promising!

 

[Guest]

WOW That's impressive. What a cool shed.
Bike is looking amazing. Did you do your own painting on the tank?

 

[blackhammer]

Not that talented with a spray gun I'm afraid so I had the tank done by a local shop.

The VTR fork length overall is exactly the same as the GK 41s, 810mm, in fact all external dimensions are almost exact.
20mm Axel on the VTRs vs 15mm for GK along with 15mm wider triples on the GK being the main differences.

 

[T8erbug]

The VTR fork length overall is exactly the same as the GK 41s, 810mm, in fact all external dimensions are almost exact.
20mm Axel on the VTRs vs 15mm for GK along with 15mm wider triples on the GK being the main differences.

Sweeeet. Thanks for the replies John and Nate! I think they'll work for one of my projects and possibly both of my Suzuki projects. I'm currently using GSXR600 RSU 45mm forks on my GS750 but it's left some ground clearance for wanting and I'm about to start a GS1000 project that I'm thinking I'll try the VTR forks on.

 

[Chuck78]

Got myself a set of VTR1000F forks, brakes, & lower triple for $130 in the mail, hoping to adapt a 15mm or 17mm GS axle to them with some machinework making up a new set of spacers.
I read the VTR's used a 17mm front axle previously, & now I read here that it used a 20mm front axle. I know the earlier models and later model forks did have different part numbers. I also read 775mm total length same as GS1000, then elsewhere I read 810mm total length. Different specs for different model years??? Have to cross reference the axles I suppose. The shorter same as gs1000 length would be preferred but the taller length would allow me to run clipons a little later in life (on top of triples) for when I develop arthritis from all the years of BMX & mountain biking body torture, decades of construction work and wrenching, etc... I predict that to be just around the corner at 40 or 45!

 

[Chuck78]

Just partzilla cross referenced, 98-00 use different fork lowers, but 98-05 use all the same front axles and upper (inner) fork stanchion tubes. $145/each, not a terribly steep price I thought.

 

[blackhammer]

Interesting but not unsurprising that they changed mid model. I just got new bearings for the front wheel hub and am making my own spacers. Its alot of effort making the spacers to use the GS axle and i found it far easier to just change bearings, the VTR forks have different dia openings at each end for the axel.

Im using the GK lower tripple and a custom upper as i wanted more width in the forks for the calipers to clear the spokes. I had to find a longer CBR front axle at the wreckers which was hours of grease filled fun...

The forks i have are off an 05 that was wrecking and they are definitely 810mm.

Ive checked out some superhawk/VTR forums looking for info on the caliper performance and have found mainly negative reviews of the standard VTR set up... most prefer to upgrade to CBR 600F4I calipers ( they require a small mod to fit) and i'm just waiting for set to come up and will grab them.

 

[John Kat]

You might want to check if the VTR SP1 calipers would fit?
I owned an SP1 a couple of years ago and the braking performance was outstanding.

 

[blackhammer]

Yes you are right John, the sp1 are the most desirable upgrade, but unfortunately those calipers are in high demand and certainly not all that easy to find, especially in Australia for me.

 

[Chuck78]

I thought about making my own spacers and getting larger bearings for the GS hubs, but the thing that held me up was the speedometer drive. I'll have to get one in my hands, but I don't know how readily that would bore out. There is a steel insert that is pressed into the aluminum housing, and there would not be much left of it if it were bored out more. this is what gives its side to side strength to torque the axle against it and use it as a spacer.

if you've got this figured out, I wonder how much it would cost to have your machinist make a second set for me and ship to the USA? Or maybe you could just share with me the measurements you ended up with so I could have my machinist friends make some?

 

[John Kat]

I thought about making my own spacers and getting larger bearings for the GS hubs, but the thing that held me up was the speedometer drive. I'll have to get one in my hands, but I don't know how readily that would bore out. There is a steel insert that is pressed into the aluminum housing, and there would not be much left of it if it were bored out more. this is what gives its side to side strength to torque the axle against it and use it as a spacer.

if you've got this figured out, I wonder how much it would cost to have your machinist make a second set for me and ship to the USA? Or maybe you could just share with me the measurements you ended up with so I could have my machinist friends make some?

The easiest way around this issue is to use an electronic tachometer.
The Koso one works fine: http://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...-Tachometer-speedometer-on-GS-1000&highlight=

 

[Chuck78]

The easiest way around this issue is to use an electronic tachometer.
The Koso one works fine: http://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...-Tachometer-speedometer-on-GS-1000&highlight=

it's really hard to preserve the classic vintage bike look when putting on electronic instruments! thanks for the tip but I'll pass on those.

 

[Chuck78]

if you don't want to buy the racetech compression cartridge set, here are some simple mods that people on vtr1000.org do. make sure to read through the comments, and remember that the spring rates that one commenter recommends are for a 420lb Super hawk, still need the recommended spring rate for your bike and your weight. I would speculate that a heavier fork oil than they recommend is also in order since you will be using a heavier spring. I would say 10wt for starters & play with the rebound adjustment to get a quick but controlled rebound. If that's still too quick, try 12.5, but no more than 15wt. this is all just based on my speculation, so don't take it as gold, but a good starting reference point.

http://vtr1000.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=29710&sid=f661b04d9fae89d4b7b54cab812499ae

and make sure you get straight rate linear springs, not progressive rate. the dampening will work much more appropriately if it has a linear increasing rate with no drastic spike in stiffness without an appropriate change in dampening at that point of suspension travel.

 

[Chuck78]

there's also this as a possible alternative to Racetech parts, although I fully endorse Racetech because they fully support so many vintage bike models:
http://www.daughertymotorsports.com/vtr1000f/vtr1000f.html

http://racetech.com/ProductSearch/2/Honda/VTR1000F/1997-2005

 

[Chuck78]

Yes you are right John, the sp1 are the most desirable upgrade, but unfortunately those calipers are in high demand and certainly not all that easy to find, especially in Australia for me.

I believe it was the RC51/SP1 Calipers that were the 32mm/34mm piston size, same as the CBR600F4i. Either of those will be the ultimate, but need minor Dremel clearancing to the body and/or the fork mounting ear, as the larger pistons make the bodies bigger compared to the tiny piston vtr1000f calipers that are otherwise the same.
Also, the 01-02 GSXR1000 6 piston calipers will give you equal or even better braking, and are a direct bolt on, no clearancing or anything. They, however, are notorious for needing the pistons cleaned AT LEAST once a season, as with 6 pistons, a little bit of dirt on each one apparently causes them to not want to retract smoothly, and eventually will get crudded up enough to almost seize, causing odd pad wear from the smallest (rear?) pistons tapering in toward the front..

A 15.87mm/16mm/5/8" master cylinder with any of those will give you very powerful brakes with a lot of lever travel/feel/modulation. A master cylinder bore of 17mm or 19mm will give you more of a firm powerful brake feel but not quite as much actual braking power. There was a really useful spreadsheet on a vtr website with ratios and sizes.

 

[Chuck78]

Here is all the info I have compiled/copied&pasted from various vtr & vfr sites, as well as an sv650 site.

GSXR's come with a nearly identical Tokico caliper to the 4 piston honda nissin's, and are easier to find in gold if you prefer that over black.




RC51 (sp1 & sp2?), cbr600F4i, cbr 929/954, and 2001 or 02 six pot GSXR1000 k1 calipers.

SP2 master cylinder has better feel?
CBR600F4i master cylinder

6 pot GSXR calipers require frequent (annual)teardown & cleaning otherwise pistons will get sticky & seize. Can leave on bike & remove calipers & squeeze lever to push out 1 set of pistons at a time & wipe crud off

http://www.vtr1000.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=15494 great info on leverages
Look for posts on radial master cylinders

The difficulty will be in finding an integrated master cylinder to match any of the larger calipers. The 11/16" master cylinder from the CBR600RR3-4 matches the calipers from the CBR954RR (2002-03 Fireblade)...I think

The calipers should be cross-compatible for following bikes:
GSXR600 01~03
GSXR750 01~03
GSXR1000 01~02
GSX1400 all years
GSR600 all years
SV1000/S all years
ZZR1200 all years
Z1000 03~06
VTR1000F all years
CBR600RR 03~04
CBR929RR 00~01
CBR900RR 95~99
CBR954RR 02~03
CB1300/CB400 03~08
Maybe fit others bikes which have Nissin/Tokico calipers C-C 62mm space.


The Tokico version of the Nissan 4 piston caliper came on the 2000-2003 GSX-R600, the 2000-2003 GSX-R750, and all model years of the SV1000,
The Nissin equivalent was on just about every Honda sportbike from that era, including the F4, F4i, 929, 954, Superhawk, VFR800, RC-51 and even the first-generation CBR600RR.

 

[Dirty Deeds]

A better option perhaps?

Where can I find a tank like that? What model did it originally come on? Thanking you in advance.