Rich, I was wondering the same thing, he did say TSCC and 8 valves with 2 cyl. will be 4 V per cyl. But I've not worked on a 400cc TSCC eng. had no clue if could possibly be different than the 750 and 1100 TSCC. Your manual shows no shim, just an adjuster and a lock nut, just the same as the bigger TSCC... He'll be back, will be interesting to hear what's going on... What's your best advice for holding the little adjuster while tightening the lock nut, if you don't have the Suzuki special tool?
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Bad gas story
- Thread starter Mat
- Start date
Well, since you asked 
. Up until now, I’ve used a homemade tool that is simply a square head screw common in construction (probably Robertson’s #2; don’t quote me) screwed into a chunk of dowel whittled to provide a grip with thumb and forefinger, and a closed end 9mm wrench. It worked quite well.
Recently, from some other member’s AliExpress link, I purchased the 2 different types of tools shown left and middle below. Got both because they were dirt cheap, like a few $ each. Left tool is all in one, middle tool is 2 separate pieces. The feeler gauge shows how I’ve trimmed and bent my target blade to fit in the tight space where it needs to go see last pic. If pressed, I’m sure I could provide a link to these tools. One took a week to arrive, the other about a month.
Playing with the new tools on a spare head, it seems like the left all in one tool will work really nicely. But this is with the head on my workbench, not in-situ, where space is tight for knuckles and tools.
. Up until now, I’ve used a homemade tool that is simply a square head screw common in construction (probably Robertson’s #2; don’t quote me) screwed into a chunk of dowel whittled to provide a grip with thumb and forefinger, and a closed end 9mm wrench. It worked quite well.Recently, from some other member’s AliExpress link, I purchased the 2 different types of tools shown left and middle below. Got both because they were dirt cheap, like a few $ each. Left tool is all in one, middle tool is 2 separate pieces. The feeler gauge shows how I’ve trimmed and bent my target blade to fit in the tight space where it needs to go see last pic. If pressed, I’m sure I could provide a link to these tools. One took a week to arrive, the other about a month.
Playing with the new tools on a spare head, it seems like the left all in one tool will work really nicely. But this is with the head on my workbench, not in-situ, where space is tight for knuckles and tools.
Mat
Forum Apprentice
Yeah that might be just that
but the valve had to be done anyway.I started a new tread in the proper section with pictures, that was before I noticed your many answers!
Thanks for many pictures
Hey I could dig that conversation where you talked about these aliexpress parts but I'd be happy to have em easy too
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We're wondering Mat, does your eng. have shims or rocker arms and adjusters, like in Rich's picture? ..Hey Rich, would have never thought there was a screw with a square slot the size if the adjusters. I like yours better than the mfg. ones, seems it would be better in tight places.
I can’t tell you what position cam lobes need to be in to do your measuring of the gap. That will be in one of the manuals that deal with Twin cylinder TSCC engines, which is what you have.
here’s the AliExpress link. Note, don’t buy this feeler gauge at the link. It doesn’t have the size blades you need. I got mine at auto zone. Actually had to return one defective gauge. It had two of the same blade and was missing the one I needed.
Anyway, when you measure the gap, ALWAYS pay attention to your units of measure. Pick inches or mm and stick with it. Manuals have measurements in both. Be sure! THIS IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT!
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832762311261.html?spm=a2g0o.order_detail.order _detail_item.3.3c4af19cDIqeuP&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa
here’s the AliExpress link. Note, don’t buy this feeler gauge at the link. It doesn’t have the size blades you need. I got mine at auto zone. Actually had to return one defective gauge. It had two of the same blade and was missing the one I needed.
Anyway, when you measure the gap, ALWAYS pay attention to your units of measure. Pick inches or mm and stick with it. Manuals have measurements in both. Be sure! THIS IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT!https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832762311261.html?spm=a2g0o.order_detail.order _detail_item.3.3c4af19cDIqeuP&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa
Mat
Forum Apprentice
Wow just wanna say I'm amazed at the help you quickly provided all of you guys. Thank you esp Rich I would not have needed to ask in another post if I had read you before.
About the other thread I started ...I guess I should repost the pictures here, maybe delete the other thread then ask an admin to move to the correct sub-forum?
To answer Rphilips It has rockers as Rijko pointed out in an incredibly fast manner after I posted pictures, check the timing
EDIT: forgot to tell I just ordered from amazon (Gorminrider provided the link for Canada in another thread) so I will have the proper tool to do the job delivered tomorow ( I was all-in for the Robertson [NODE="2"]s[/NODE]crew anyway:highly_amused
and here's a picture of my gauges
About the other thread I started ...I guess I should repost the pictures here, maybe delete the other thread then ask an admin to move to the correct sub-forum?
To answer Rphilips It has rockers as Rijko pointed out in an incredibly fast manner after I posted pictures, check the timing
EDIT: forgot to tell I just ordered from amazon (Gorminrider provided the link for Canada in another thread) so I will have the proper tool to do the job delivered tomorow ( I was all-in for the Robertson [NODE="2"]s[/NODE]crew anyway:highly_amused
and here's a picture of my gauges
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You don’t need the Suzuki special tool in your picture. It’s for lifting the cam shaft so you can pick the shim out of the bucket. You have neither shims nor buckets. Tuck that away in the back of your tool box for some day when you have a Suzuki engine with shim over bucket valves.
Mat
Forum Apprentice
Yeah until then I thought all GS had shims but I'm glad I don't have to order or exchange any.
Rich the manual you pointed to me on post 20 doesn't have a procedure how to check for valves, it only gives the proper clearance (0.08 - 0.13 mm) and on section 5 the valve timing wich I don't know how to interpret to do the job (not even sure that's relevant)
How do you proceed exactly and in what order to adjust? should I search for rocker and tappet valve adjustment? It looks important to me to do the same adjustment on each pair
Rich the manual you pointed to me on post 20 doesn't have a procedure how to check for valves, it only gives the proper clearance (0.08 - 0.13 mm) and on section 5 the valve timing wich I don't know how to interpret to do the job (not even sure that's relevant)
How do you proceed exactly and in what order to adjust? should I search for rocker and tappet valve adjustment? It looks important to me to do the same adjustment on each pair
Mat, on my quick glance through that multi-model 400 manual, I also did not see the valve adjustment procedure. I just assumed it was in there somewhere. I’ll do some digging and see what I can find. I don’t want to send you to the instructions for a 4 cylinder TSCC because I have to believe it will be misleading.
This manual for the 250T-300L Twins from BikeCliffs Website clearly shows the valve clearance procedure on a TSCC Twin. Starts on page 2-5 (pg. 30 of the pdf).
https://gsarchive.bwringer.com/mtsac/~cliff/storage/gs/GS250T-300LZ_manual-82.pdf
This manual for the 250T-300L Twins from BikeCliffs Website clearly shows the valve clearance procedure on a TSCC Twin. Starts on page 2-5 (pg. 30 of the pdf).
https://gsarchive.bwringer.com/mtsac/~cliff/storage/gs/GS250T-300LZ_manual-82.pdf
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Mat
Forum Apprentice
Thank you very much Rich I would not know where to look.
I have read and printed pages 30-31 and I better understand where to measure with the gauge but I'm not sure about how to position the camshaft for it.
Will make some tries when I'm back home tonight, and post pictures for help
On another note I'm curious about my motor design, is TSCC a better or less solid design in general?
I have read and printed pages 30-31 and I better understand where to measure with the gauge but I'm not sure about how to position the camshaft for it.
Will make some tries when I'm back home tonight, and post pictures for help
On another note I'm curious about my motor design, is TSCC a better or less solid design in general?
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Suzuki thought it was “Better” I guess, but apparently not enough to use the design in their shaft-driven motorcycles of the time. There are a few pages about the TSCC design in that manual.
I'll highlight some key points from the manual where the images are faint/hard to read and where the instructions aren't very thorough.
Pardon me if I write something that you think is obvious. I don't know what you don't know, and I was where you are 5 years ago.
You need to take the ignition cover off the right side of the engine. There's no oil behind it, and no gasket except maybe a paper dust gasket that you can re-use.
Removing Spark plugs will make turning the crank easier/smoother.
You need a 19mm wrench to turn the nut on this end of the crank shaft CLOCKWISE ONLY / the direction the motor turns, to get the mark by the "T" on the advance wheel to line up with the arrow you should see in the hole in the ignition plate. The cam shaft ends have a notch in them that is hard to see in the pics in the manual I've highlighted them as:
Red- Position A,
Blue-Position B
With the timing mark at "T", The cam shaft end notches should either be at position A, or position B
If at position A, you measure and adjust. Intake. and Exhaust of the Right Cylinder, and Intake of the Left Cylinder (Right is as you're sitting on the bike- this is always the case when manual refers to Right and Left).
or.
If at position B, you measure and adjust Exhaust of Left Cylinder.
After you complete measuring and adjusting at one position, you rotate the the crank shaft 360 deg. bringing it back to the "T" mark, but the notches will be now in the other position.
I think it's a good idea after measuring.at one position to turn the crank 2 full revolutions, and measure again, just to be sure. Probably not necessary, but couldn't hurt.
Pardon me if I write something that you think is obvious. I don't know what you don't know, and I was where you are 5 years ago.
You need to take the ignition cover off the right side of the engine. There's no oil behind it, and no gasket except maybe a paper dust gasket that you can re-use.
Removing Spark plugs will make turning the crank easier/smoother.
You need a 19mm wrench to turn the nut on this end of the crank shaft CLOCKWISE ONLY / the direction the motor turns, to get the mark by the "T" on the advance wheel to line up with the arrow you should see in the hole in the ignition plate. The cam shaft ends have a notch in them that is hard to see in the pics in the manual I've highlighted them as:
Red- Position A,
Blue-Position B
With the timing mark at "T", The cam shaft end notches should either be at position A, or position B
If at position A, you measure and adjust. Intake. and Exhaust of the Right Cylinder, and Intake of the Left Cylinder (Right is as you're sitting on the bike- this is always the case when manual refers to Right and Left).
or.
If at position B, you measure and adjust Exhaust of Left Cylinder.
After you complete measuring and adjusting at one position, you rotate the the crank shaft 360 deg. bringing it back to the "T" mark, but the notches will be now in the other position.
I think it's a good idea after measuring.at one position to turn the crank 2 full revolutions, and measure again, just to be sure. Probably not necessary, but couldn't hurt.
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The biggest job by far is cleaning off all the old gasket. It looked pretty bad in the pics on your other thread.
Mat
Forum Apprentice
All went pretty good after all. Yeah, that gasket was a mess to pick up.
I have one question before I fire the engine, the left intake valves required a lot of adjustment. Most valves were tight and required a quarter turn but the left intake valves required a lot and you can see it top left, the adjusting nut is really high over the lock nut compared to the others (you can only see one on the pic but both are about the same. Should I be worried?
I noticed hand cranking is smoother after the valve adjustment
I have one question before I fire the engine, the left intake valves required a lot of adjustment. Most valves were tight and required a quarter turn but the left intake valves required a lot and you can see it top left, the adjusting nut is really high over the lock nut compared to the others (you can only see one on the pic but both are about the same. Should I be worried?
I noticed hand cranking is smoother after the valve adjustment
Yes, I would double/triple check your measurements before you close it up. Make sure the cam shaft end notches are in position A to measure L intake as I noted above.
